Spinaltapp Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 So you want SWTOR to be just like Eve? I class eve as its own genre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torothin Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 No, I want there to be an end game that does not involve mindless grinding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islefive Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) Wow at release had less content then SWTOR does but wow at endgame in vanilla felt more rewarding. Gear did not rain from the heavens onto all who played. It would take work to get upgrades. SWTOR feels small, very small, and WOW feels small now as well. In swtor I have not left RF in 2-3 weeks on my 50 because well I can make it to the operations and I can queue from their. I refuse to queue from any planet because of the horrible load times and I am running the game on an SSD. WoW at release felt larger because the non instanced world (other then dungeons) right now in swtor it is so broken up and the zones are so poorly designed with walls everywhere. I understand why dev's did it so you can cram more content into a smaller area and make people take more time doing the content due to the fact you have to run around walls all the time. I had such high hopes for this game but now in PVP it feels like stun stun, dead. Just repeat that over and over again. On Illum because we are outnumbered by a good 4:1 ratio is not worth even going to when you cannot leave your fort. Currently I am only logging in to do Operations and that is getting boring since even Hardmode operations are a joke. There is no challenge in PVE in this game and PVP is broken beyond belief. Once GW2 comes out I and the majority of my guild will be quitting. That is about another 40 people who feel that they were deceived by BW I would love to go back and play EvE but right now its a numbers game and no one will engage me and my buddies unless they outnumber us 2:1. Edited January 31, 2012 by Islefive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skizzik Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 You said stiff. I giggled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harabek Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 notice how the guys with the 2008/2009/2010 join dates are always "just be patient" and "every mmo is like this" and "thanks cya later can i have your stuff" etc etc, and the guys with the late 2011/2012 join dates are always "this game is rubbish" and "pvp is terrible" and "game is dying" type posts. i think there are 2 distinct groups of players, those of us who play tor just because it's a mmo, we really don't give a hoot about star wars. Then the other group, the star wars fans who have been obsessing over this game for years and in their eyes it is perfect and can do no wrong.....because it has pretty glow stiicks. Guess i have to re-register I quit because i like SW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unicornfive Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 How many times must it be said--you have to give the development team time. There are not enough hours in the day or days in the year to create an entire universe AND fill it with every conceivable feature of pre-existing, popular MMOs. World of Warcraft didn't have arenas, battlegrounds or even honor points awarded for killing enemies in the open world in its first year, let alone first month. There were barely any mods, barely any dungeons (how many times did you run Stratholm over and over, followed by repeats of Onyxia/MC). All of this takes time to implement, especially when you consider that SWTOR is trying to advance the genre by adding a significant amount of voice acting to every facet of the game. GIVE. IT. TIME. But feel free to unsubscribe and stop posting in the meantime. They "wasted" their time to get 1-49 good, and didnt care about 50+. From 1 to 49, it was the best mmo i ever played... But it didnt last more than 2 weeks... I wouldnt mind if 1-49 failed miserably, had no dialogs and would be endless mob farm or wz farm, cause once i hit 50, then the game starts.... Here they made the oposite....once u hit 50, the game ends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Agree that there is a misunderstanding of what PvP is about and that misunderstand is supported by folks that have not played a game where the player is not as important as the groups goal. Although the groups goal may fall apart without the player. The PvP endgame here is pretty easy to fix. So there is hope. check back in a year. Severe PvP item damage or loot drop would fix the whole endgame and create a living economy. Add OWPvP resource points to fight over that effect item repair or darkness falls like content and tada! Player driven scenarios that are more than the zerg. The problem is wow which is insanely popular and has terrible end game PvP completely wrapped around the gear grind. and so guess where the PvP priority goes to according to the share holders. WHERES MY MONEY! That said the PvE in wow must be best of the best. The PvE in eve although engaging as far as ship design goes is pretty poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinesusmc Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 It's the state of MMO's today I guess. Kind of sad actually. I can tell that you played SWG and are wishing all of that is in this game... I would love to see some of that myself but that is the problem with today's MMO players they don't want to work for what they do they want it given to them...cough..WOW...cough I love dying tons of times trying to figure things out, long travel times for the exploration, now that quests is near impossible to change they already changed the quest by giving VO and story behind it and that is a really big step so far. Instancing unfortunately is needed with today's graphics if they want a big audience to play with various computers and I'm ok with it and the housing in SWG was cool to a point but I like the ship thing way better. Either way I am loving the game and I hope they keep it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vortexdr Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Still a gear grind, just different... Everybody starts with T1 garbage.. time, skills, ??? later you gots T2.. more time skills ??? later T3. Don't fool yourself into thinking EVE is something it isn't.. or worse yet, that it isn't something it is. Still Eve has a lot more content then SWTOR can ever hope for... Why? Simple.. its totally different and its a sandbox. EVE is not restricted to such lame things as good and evil. The players run the game. Then again Eve has very much stagnated these days. I'm in PL so top of the food chain and its getting boring. But still there have been other games that had the right idea. Take a look at Shadowbane. Hardcore pvp at its finest with a death penalty that matters and once again an end-game that is controlled by players. What people dont realize though is that SWTOR's model does sell. Hardcore PVPERS very much the minority. The vast majority of people could never deal with a real death penatly or losing allt heir work ina few hours. Seriously... dont compare EVE to this game... not even in the same league. Here people cry because an op killed them. (they dont lose ****) if they run into a cap in EVE...they lose it all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sykomyke Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 This is ridiculous. Do you realize what your "list" is asking for? Not only that but you expect ALL of this from a game that is one month out of development. Again, do the plethora of users on this forum need to remind you that WoW (That which most people seem to compare SWTOR to) barely had Molten Core in place? And the only reason people didn't kill Ragnaros in the first month was because the entire instance was designed with a reputation grind in place that took at least a few weeks of killing trash mobs/bosses to get enough rep for the water) If some or all of the following were done, I would seriously consider coming back: Add Planets with no specific level range. Just a very mysterious Star Wars planet where you can run into mobs that are level 1 or level 50. All levels are there, low and high. Be CarefulWhat's the point of this? Just to have a random area to frustrate people? This literally serves no purpose at all. You don't even go into WHY you would want a planet with "random" mobs. That's not constructive feedback, they literally have NOTHING to go on.No yellow brick road quests where you literally follow a road and questline like a robot to the next quest line or area. It works in other games because they are much more openThere are plenty of non yellow brick road quests. Try datacron hunting. Lore object hunting. Try revealing the entire map on every planet. Try getting the +10 datacron. Quests are just that. QUESTS. They give you an objective. It sounds like you want this to turn into some sort of Korean Grindfest.When you open a map, have it be the entire world, not just some tiny segment. I know you can click the whole world map and see the whole world but it still seems so small and segmented like I'm running from one ride or warehouse to anotherThis is already in the game. It's a preference you can set. Honestly did you even bother looking or did you come to the forums complaining?No wallsI don't even....what? "invisible" walls are there to keep people from going places they shouldn't be going.No exhaustion from running into the desertYes, because everything programmers love is creating an endless desert where you can get lost and then complain to a GM that you can't get back to Mos Ila because your port is on cooldown. Let's not even go into the massive resources generating an endless desert with no purpose would create.More mystery. More mystical mysterious Gameplay. You know, like Star WarsGeneric random statement is generic. You literally offer nothing to the programmers to work with here.More immersionYou mean beyond the immersion of you interacting with your mentors/companions/quest givers? Again, you don't offer HOW more immersion would be achieved.More in-depth crafting - Crafting that YOU as the player actually have to do and not only your CompanionSeriously? People are never happy. They tried to make it so you DIDN'T have to stop doing something to craft. You can be running an instance and still craft. Seriously how are you complaining that you can't craft something?Player Housing on a planet that's non-instanced. No there would not be a blight if they just added rent with limits on how much you could pre-payThis was in SWG. It failed...pretty badly.Chat BubblesNext.Scalable UIComing soon. Movable UIComing soon Pet MountsPokemon? next.Vehicle Mounts that actually work and feel right. In TOR they just don't feel right. The vehicles in TOR feel and drive like a hula skirt that you're wearing. It feels very fakeAnd I supposed flying a nether-drake or mounting a raptor isn't fake? Community???? More People - Stop the Sharding/InstancingBecause you know what I love more then people? Lag. Lots of lag. Yes let's get rid of instancing! I love zoning into an area and watching my fps drop.Pets that are not CompanionsWe have pets that aren't companions. Seriously....are you even trying?Less Gated GameplayThe only "gate" out there is in PvP with expertise, beyond that most of the other stuff isn't that gated.True Open WorldsNews flash: "Worlds" in SWTOR are like zones in WoW. They are just named differently.More in-depth Meaningful HarvestingSigh...next.Remove the mountain Walls, regular walls. Stop making me run 5 miles in one direction to get to an objective that is just on the other side of another wallDidn't you ask earlier for more "immersion"? So make your choice immersion with mountains, or would you prefer your NPC's to just hand you gold and experience for just gracing them with your presence?Broker that worksBroker? Next.Guild Halls - Non-InstancedComing soon. No Mobs on every single node and every single path. It's ridiculousYou can avoid most mobs unless you are doing a quest. Even then it's not like they are particular hard.No Combat Delay...Better TexturesThey are working on this. So far in this entire farce of a list the only legit complaint I've seen so far.Food with Stats crafted by PlayersNo. That's what your "Channel Hatred/Seethe/etc" abilities are for. Also. Food=Stims in this game.Moddable Orange Armor that has a base stat so that it is actually worth something more than appearanceModdable Armor is based upon the actual armor value of "armoring" so if you want it to be good, just put better armoring in it. Are you seriously that dense?Open World PvP with actual rewards so that everyone isn't always in WZ's on PvP Servers. And NO NOT JUST ILUMMeh. You mean like old school WoW, which they changed.Slow level progression down with sandbox elements that would make people slow down because they desire toI'm too tired to even bother with this one. It's the state of MMO's today I guess. Kind of sad actually. The only thing sad here is the list you created. You have probably one legit complaint. The rest is just drivel and/or stuff you haven't researched. Honestly I think you are trolling, but I'll give you benefit of the doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardya Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) A ranking system where PvP stats can be seen and rewards given then I might stick around. But so far, 6 months is a lot to ask. last night was the first time I spent the night reading a book as opposed to playing this game. That's not a good sign... A ranking system makes it worth it? Either you enjoy the game and the progression or you don't. I enjoy the WZ's and am like 57 valor and enjoying progressing my character with more gear. Recently I started an alt and am enjoying that. I just heard some of the non-PVP stuff has good rewards for PvP players so I mat do some heroics. I have not started space missions or crafting yet. And I played a lot. There is a new WZ coming soon and new gear. If you don't like the game then you should leave but a Ranking system will not change anything in my opinion. No MMO will make new WZ's every day. Anyone can post in any game that they are bored and that they are doing the same thing over and over. Edited January 31, 2012 by richardya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waypoc Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 This is ridiculous. Do you realize what your "list" is asking for? Not only that but you expect ALL of this from a game that is one month out of development. Again, do the plethora of users on this forum need to remind you that WoW (That which most people seem to compare SWTOR to) barely had Molten Core in place? And the only reason people didn't kill Ragnaros in the first month was because the entire instance was designed with a reputation grind in place that took at least a few weeks of killing trash mobs/bosses to get enough rep for the water) The only thing sad here is the list you created. You have probably one legit complaint. The rest is just drivel and/or stuff you haven't researched. Honestly I think you are trolling, but I'll give you benefit of the doubt. LOL yeah. I'm glad you read with an open mind and not a BW myopic lense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islefive Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Still Eve has a lot more content then SWTOR can ever hope for... Why? Simple.. its totally different and its a sandbox. EVE is not restricted to such lame things as good and evil. The players run the game. Then again Eve has very much stagnated these days. I'm in PL so top of the food chain and its getting boring. But still there have been other games that had the right idea. Take a look at Shadowbane. Hardcore pvp at its finest with a death penalty that matters and once again an end-game that is controlled by players. What people dont realize though is that SWTOR's model does sell. Hardcore PVPERS very much the minority. The vast majority of people could never deal with a real death penatly or losing allt heir work ina few hours. Seriously... dont compare EVE to this game... not even in the same league. Here people cry because an op killed them. (they dont lose ****) if they run into a cap in EVE...they lose it all... How has EvE stagnated if your in PL, didn't XXXdeathXXX just award you guys a juicy contract? Or has that expired? Or is it basically Tracking titans and listening to Shadoo rage on mumble? Grab some extremely expensive T3's and go hunt noobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinesusmc Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 While your opinion is, um, admirable, the last several MMO releases have shown that - if you can't deliver your intended experience to players within the first month, you will lose them. You don't just have 6 months to take your time and get it all right. Look at GW2. They haven't and won't declare a firm release date because they are committed to their product ON DAY 1. Something that TOR (as surely influenced by EA) was clearly not committed to. They put the burden on us to slog through a buggy, unstable, unresponsive game until they had time to fix it. Let me tell you that you are in the minority. People don't play a game for 6 months waiting for it to get better. There is competition, and it's stiff. I don't believe in competition in gaming either you like the game or you don't and if you don't like the game because of bugs then leave and with will play it till it gets fixed welcome to the MMO community it happens I have been playing in MMO's since EQ and have played nearly all of them (MMO's that is). So be patient and enjoy what you can one can not compete with the other its taste. If your taste can jump that quickly then you mind is not in the MMO world and more in the console world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torothin Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 Yeah. I have decided to un-sub and will come back when and if things change. I should have never bought that naga razor mouse. To those of you who enjoy this game then I tip my hat to you and hope that you keep having a great time. I'm going back to Eve. the PvP and player interaction here just does not cut it. Thank you for all the kind words and reading to my post. - Toro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezzikah Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 This. My WoW experience from release: Nov04-Jan05 - Leveling Jan05-Feb05 - LBRS/UBRS/Scholo/Strat x 1,000 Feb05-June05 - Log in weekly to raid MC, MC, and MC. PvP = wander around Tauren Mill (just a flat field where people decided to PvP) and enjoy the low fps slideshow. June05 - 2009? Enjoyed the game immensely post BWL and other new content. For me, personally, Feb05-June05, months 3 through 7 were a wasteland, with nothing at all to do at max level except join the same 8 boss raid for months, and months. Outside of that, I rarely logged in. Flash forward to month seven, and the content got better, with more and more to do at end game. Glad I was patient. No clue why people keep trying to compare TOR to WoW at release,If anything you need to compare it to current WoW or any other MMO that's on the market now not 7+ years ago. You wouldn't buy a cell phone or computer then justify it's lack of options by comparing it to one that's 7+ years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superg Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) I'm on the same page as Torothin, although I have no idea what Eve is, after a while this game does kinda get boring, I mean without your companion to help you its hard to take on multiple opponents of your level without dying. My favourite MMO will forever be SWG, there was no end game in SWG and the game was open world, SWTOR is more of a console game made MMO, and there's no free roam, it's go here, shoot these guys, go back and talk to this guy and so forth. In SWG the free roam was awesome, you could explore a lot more than you can in TOR and after level 90 there was space, instances, GCW, PVP, more RP ability, and especially the PVP ranking system, which after you hit officer rank in your faction your rank began to decay and you had to continue playing in-order to keep your rank up. I'm not saying that SWTOR is a terrible game and will never be a good one, but I expected more from it at launch after all the hype it caused. If anyone here is interested in bringing back SWG the way it was when it closed Google search projectswg, and no I'm not a bot, just a guy stating his opinion. And hoping he won't get in trouble for saying the projectswg thing...... Edited January 31, 2012 by Superg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamzaBehoulve Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 That's what end game is in every mmo. What made you think it'd be any different? Can't be more wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superg Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 No clue why people keep trying to compare TOR to WoW at release,If anything you need to compare it to current WoW or any other MMO that's on the market now not 7+ years ago. You wouldn't buy a cell phone or computer then justify it's lack of options by comparing it to one that's 7+ years old. I didn't know that 7 year old computers and cellphones had more options than today's one's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unicornfive Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The problem is wow which is insanely popular and has terrible end game PvP completely wrapped around the gear grind. Got anything to prove that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaShuk Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Game has it's good points but a friend and I were both talking the other day about how once we get to 50 there's really no point in playing anymore since neither of us really pvp and that's all the end game content consists of at this point. Our server is also pretty awful for trying to get a group together to do Flashpoints. The level curve makes this game super easy. Nearly 50 on my Shadow Consular and I've been 3-4 levels ahead of each planet as I advance in my storyline just by completing the bonus arcs on each planet and running my space mission dailies. Boss battles are pretty underwhelming. Gear is easy to come by and I feel like crafting is mostly useless, other than some of the stims and medpacks you can get with bio. Honestly I feel that BW rushed this game out to get it out before X-mas so they would see a huge increase in sales for their 4th quarter reporting. This game easily needed another month or two of testing given all the issues, some fairly basic, that have been happening and the amount of patching this game has gone through already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sykomyke Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) LOL yeah. I'm glad you read with an open mind and not a BW myopic lense. And you still provide no more evidence to the contrary that you are doing nothing but complaining without any actual direction. Complaining with constructive reasoning backing it can be useful. You're complaints have no constructive feedback included in them and MANY of them are already in the game. You literally named a multitude of things that were announced to be future content in the upcoming months; OR they are already in the game. The rest of your suggestions literally held no water or were inane because they aren't feasible within the realm of realistic software development. Seriously, given the response time of your post I doubt you even read what I wrote for each of your points. Some of your points make no sense and don't provide any other information to help the development team progress. They are there just to be loud noises. AkA Whining. Here's some reading for you below. Human minds are expert at creating expectations, standards, and presumptions for all manner of things beyond their control. Those expectations may be unrealistic, but they can compel a person to complain all the same. One of the long-term costs of unchecked whining, is being ostracized by folks who tire of hearing it. While a bit of whining about shared problems can establish common ground and bring us closer to each other, too much can leave a person socially adrift. It's testimony to humanity's capacity for social subtlety. Another unsurprising long-term cost is unhappiness. Since we tend to believe what we see ourselves doing and hear ourselves saying, chronic complainers run the risk of buying into their unhappy words and losing sight of life's pleasures. -Psych Today Even if you didn't read that. Let me put it in a nutshell. Complaining can get things done if done right. Whining is nothing more then self-gratification. Edited January 31, 2012 by Sykomyke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torothin Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 And you still no more evidence to the contrary that you are doing nothing but complaining without any actual direction. Complaining with constructive reasoning backing it can be useful. You're complaints have no constructive feedback included in them and MANY of them are already in the game. You literally named a multitude of things that were announced to be future content in the upcoming months; OR they are already in the game. The rest of your suggestions literally held no water or were inane because they aren't feasible within the realm of realistic software development. Seriously, given the response time of your post I doubt you even read what I wrote for each of your points. Some of your points make no sense and don't provide any other information to help the development team progress. They are there just to be loud noises. AkA Whining. Here's some reading for you below. Human minds are expert at creating expectations, standards, and presumptions for all manner of things beyond their control. Those expectations may be unrealistic, but they can compel a person to complain all the same. One of the long-term costs of unchecked whining, is being ostracized by folks who tire of hearing it. While a bit of whining about shared problems can establish common ground and bring us closer to each other, too much can leave a person socially adrift. It's testimony to humanity's capacity for social subtlety. Another unsurprising long-term cost is unhappiness. Since we tend to believe what we see ourselves doing and hear ourselves saying, chronic complainers run the risk of buying into their unhappy words and losing sight of life's pleasures. -Psych Today Even if you didn't read that. Let me put it in a nutshell. Complaining can get things done if done right. Whining is nothing more then self-gratification. Several posts make sense. The best end game is no end game. IE sandbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Got anything to prove that? Only hearsay from folks that dig PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinesusmc Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I do believe they've had 5 years (and it shows, as the systems in game all "feel" 5 years old in their design concept). Did you ever think they wanted it simple to allow for anyone to play! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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