Trooper healing gimped?

[Comieb]

My main problem is that there is little to no 'Combat' in the 'Combat Medic'.

Outside of Trauma Probe there is no preventative healing, weak hots no shielding, we are the scifi Paladins healers.

 

Heal spam extraordinaire.

 

id like to see some tech used, for shielding or hots so that we can put some Combat back in.

[Gannacus]

Love the class - just changed over from Gunnery and wish I had sooner. Couple of posts have referred to Force users - ok compared to Sage we may seem 'slightly gimped' - but theres something satisfying about working extra hard to heal the group - its good were not as good as or better than the Sage - just as the Sage is not as good as us as pumping out the damage when required.

[zDracor]

I did a bit of trooper healing before switching to Gunnery (Our scoundrel really hated DPSnig, and wanted to swap) The AoE healing is secondary, but it's a nice bonus heal. The biggest problem I found was a distinct lack of incoming tank damage (Troopers primary strength), and lots of smaller raid damage. Sages are straight up better than any other healer at handling those situations.

[Pedis]

No such thing as being out of force for a Trooper. Indefinitely heal with the combat cell (ok not a massive amount but it can top up characters with no use of ammo so you can have everyone at full health AND save for big burst hits) and unlike the Sage it has a fast in-battle ammo regen.

 

Supercharge Cells for when the **** hits the fan (adds overrunning the group)? Sage cant crank it to 11 because their dial stops at 10.

 

Kolto Bomb costs very little and can be cast every 6 seconds to heal 3. Better targeting of small group healing than very expensive massive group healing on a sage? Massive grouping may even be impossible because some bosses really discourage grouping up with AOE attacks.

 

I believe all healers are viable in their own way. Don't choose one method of healing as the decider for how viable all healing classes are.

 

im sorry but there is a few things you got wrong in your post mate for once we can and often do run out of ammo now granted it might not be as fast as a sage i cant say as my sage is only level 25 the main problem with the trooper healing as i see it at the moment is that we are suppose to fill the role of tank healer and we don't really do a good job in that role due to a few problems mainly our healing is burst meaning i can heal 18k (in full rakata) but then i have a what i call "dead time" period were i can do nothing sure i can spam medic probe but that will run me out of ammo in 4-5 cast's if i don't have advanced medic probe off CD

 

as for kolto bomb yes it does not cost much and it got a pretty decent healing to it but it heals 3 compliantly random targets that is no good at all since that will just apply the +healing buff (form talents) on a random target and not a target that needs it

 

our 41 point talent is a nice instant big heal but that is about it its not really something exacting even with super charged it does nothing so its just a flat boring heal nothing like the sage "im gonna put this huge thing on the floor that will do insane healing" spell sages got

 

so as you can see we do have good burst healing but we have no sustain and our kolto bomb is pretty useless as it is right now (note on some fights like soa after the jumps it does come in handy as everyone has taken about the same amount of damage)

[EthicsGradient]

You can sustain burst better if you pop supercharge and alternate AMP/MP along with a buffed kolto at beginning and end.

[VelnikSP]

you could always play a scoundrel for a while to gain a fresh new appreciation for trooper healing?

[Mirdthestrill]

What are people's thoughts on the Trooper feeling as though it was not meant to be a full healer? I have been 50 for a few weeks now and have almost full Columi set, and heave healed countless HM's with some of those being 8 mans. Most of the time (for the 8 mans), the other healer has been a Sage. Next to a Sage, I 'feel' that trooper healing comes up short. What also bothers me is that in past MMO's/multiplayer games, I have rolled either a healer or a support class of sorts, but with Trooper healing, on a gut/instinct level, I feel as though something is off about trying to heal with this class.

 

Am I paranoid? Have other people had luck with healing as a Trooper?

 

I am sure some of you are thinking, "Well if you are into healing that much, why not roll sage?" The thought had crossed my mind, but this game is very focused on force users, so I thought I'd mix it up a bit, plus I like the concept of the Trooper for story, RP, etc.

 

(1)

We are nowhere near as good as the Sage.

 

(2)

We could use a buff

 

(3)

We can heal perfectly fine as we are

 

All three are truth.

[moman]

(1)

We are nowhere near as good as the Sage.

 

(2)

We could use a buff

 

(3)

We can heal perfectly fine as we are

 

All three are truth.

 

I agree with 1 and 2. Again, I'm not asking for a major buff, just a slight bump. Good news though, on the 2nd (I think) weekly dev response thing, they mentioned Sage's were healing a bit more than intended and mentioned adding something more to our AoE. It's all supposed to come in 1.2.

[Mcfondles]

I feel like the commando healer is actually the best healing class for any situation..

[NuJedi]

I feel like the commando healer is actually the best healing class for any situation..

 

we ARE the best single target healer in the game

[eMAeM]

doenst look gimped to me (:

 

http://s1.directupload.net/images/120223/vv9sdv77.jpg

[Aritok]

I never had any problems to heal any HM Flashpoints. The only time a tank was dying was because of enrage or wipe.

 

But it really start to annoy me, when i get told by my guild, that we "NEED" two sage healers for this specific boss in OPS. Just becauce the AE damage it to much, and sages are just clear better in it. This give me the feeling, that i am not good enough.

 

Best example is Soa. Jumping down the means everyone getting alot of damage. With single heals you cant ge them up fast enough. With one sage he is saying he is out of force when we are down, from all the patch heals.

 

 

No one cares about the bonus you give, like 10% less damage, 10% better healing after KB, 10% more armor. No one is seeing this. They only see the green numbers and their HP. And sages just get a massive AE heal over time that does really well compensate the lack of skill of some DPS to avoid damage.

 

I am already close to reroll to sage healer as well. Just becauce i am sick of it to get told "well. you are not sage, but better than nothing for healing".

[Gezzer]

I never had any problems to heal any HM Flashpoints. The only time a tank was dying was because of enrage or wipe.

 

But it really start to annoy me, when i get told by my guild, that we "NEED" two sage healers for this specific boss in OPS. Just becauce the AE damage it to much, and sages are just clear better in it. This give me the feeling, that i am not good enough.

 

Best example is Soa. Jumping down the means everyone getting alot of damage. With single heals you cant ge them up fast enough. With one sage he is saying he is out of force when we are down, from all the patch heals.

 

 

No one cares about the bonus you give, like 10% less damage, 10% better healing after KB, 10% more armor. No one is seeing this. They only see the green numbers and their HP. And sages just get a massive AE heal over time that does really well compensate the lack of skill of some DPS to avoid damage.

 

I am already close to reroll to sage healer as well. Just becauce i am sick of it to get told "well. you are not sage, but better than nothing for healing".

 

I hear you. We are pretty much SWtOR's version of the holy pally, with pretty much the same results as I saw in WoW. The problem as I see is two things. Some commando healers who don't understand the class and how to play it effectively so we get a bad rap. The second, too many people who don't understand what we can bring to the table, so they'd rather go the safe route. Give it time. That and a bit of tweaking and we'll get our chance to shine (I hope).

[RuQu]

Only fix we desperately need is smart healing on Kolto Bomb. increase to 4-8 targets would be nice (even at 8, it still would heal for 46% of Sage AoE, over equivalent time spans ie 5 KBs vs 3 Salvs).

 

Having limits on the number of players it hits without having smart healing is just plain wrong. It's already the most limited AoE in the game, why cripple it with the lack of smart healing?

 

They should look at our ammo windows though, and re-tune them to match the Mercenaries better. Mercs have high regen for 39% of their Heat, then medium for 41% and low for 20%. We have high for 33%, medium for 42%, and low for 25%. Yes this effect is noticeable.

[IIIDCManIII]

What are people's thoughts on the Trooper feeling as though it was not meant to be a full healer? I have been 50 for a few weeks now and have almost full Columi set, and heave healed countless HM's with some of those being 8 mans. Most of the time (for the 8 mans), the other healer has been a Sage. Next to a Sage, I 'feel' that trooper healing comes up short. What also bothers me is that in past MMO's/multiplayer games, I have rolled either a healer or a support class of sorts, but with Trooper healing, on a gut/instinct level, I feel as though something is off about trying to heal with this class.

 

Am I paranoid? Have other people had luck with healing as a Trooper?

 

Well Combat Medic is really not spec'd as a primary healer in larger groups. I have found that I can be an effective healer is standard 4 person groups. But when it gets larger you fade out, but I am totally ok with that because at that point my role is mostly a DPS and heal when appropriate.

[TUXs]

I agree with 1 and 2. Again, I'm not asking for a major buff, just a slight bump. Good news though, on the 2nd (I think) weekly dev response thing, they mentioned Sage's were healing a bit more than intended and mentioned adding something more to our AoE. It's all supposed to come in 1.2.

 

The Trooper AOE heal is the weakness vs. Sage healing. Simply boosting Kolto bomb would make a tremendous difference.

[RuQu]

Well Combat Medic is really not spec'd as a primary healer in larger groups. I have found that I can be an effective healer is standard 4 person groups. But when it gets larger you fade out, but I am totally ok with that because at that point my role is mostly a DPS and heal when appropriate.

 

Absolutely everything about this statement is wrong, except the line about working well in 4-man groups.

 

What Ops are you running that bring a Combat Medic as DPS?

 

How does one argue that the best ST healer in the game is not meant to be used in anything over 4-man?

[SpaniardInfinity]

Absolutely everything about this statement is wrong, except the line about working well in 4-man groups.

 

What Ops are you running that bring a Combat Medic as DPS?

 

How does one argue that the best ST healer in the game is not meant to be used in anything over 4-man?

 

I would assume he means being a support DPS, in the sense that when everyone is topped off at max and you aren't needed for healing, you might as well do some damage (I wouldn't call it DPS, though; there seems to be a misconception that if you are dealing any damage at all you are a DPS). Or possibly he switches off to another power cell or respecs into another tree in 8-mans.

 

As for us not being useful in 8+ man missions, you're wrong. We might not bring anything new to the table that the other healers don't already have (part of the whole push to improve Trooper anyway), but as it stands we are very much so dependable healers. There are some things to be desired, but I don't think you'll regret bringing a Combat Medic along (I can make a tank out of anyone ).

Edited February 23, 2012 by SpaniardInfinity

[IIIDCManIII]

I would assume he means being a support DPS, in the sense that when everyone is topped off at max and you aren't needed for healing, you might as well do some damage (I wouldn't call it DPS, though; there seems to be a misconception that if you are dealing any damage at all you are a DPS). Or possibly he switches off to another power cell or respecs into another tree in 8-mans.

 

What I meant was the first part I switch to damage dealing when ppl are topped off. I consider the AOE enough to be DPS. I would agree that we are dependable healers but the inability to do whole groups at once past 3 people makes us a little weaker.

Edited February 23, 2012 by IIIDCManIII

[Ralphieokole]

I really am thankful for so many bads playing combat medics so we can continue to see buffs. We all know the bads get buffed, so they will be mediocre.

 

I am already OP as a healer, and just getting better with any additional buffs. Sure there are some changes I would like to see, but they are mostly minor and not game changing.

 

Btw everyone that keeps comparing KB to Salvation... you realize that it is an 11pt (13 pt if you spec into residue) Vs a 31pt talent right? If you think they should be equivalent, you are being unreasonable.

[Darturion]

Trooper Healer + Sage = Awesome

 

The FPs are designed around two healers, make it diverse and it's better. You have a Shield and the best Single target healer etc.

 

Why haven't other people figured this out?

 

Scoundrel right now is the only one suffering really mostly because burst healing is a weakness for them.

 

I honestly prefer a Trooper Healer over a Sage. Less squishy, more durable, and has a free attack from range etc. To me the Sage has a nice "Area Heal" (not group heal) and CC.

 

I play a Sage btw.

[SpaniardInfinity]

Btw everyone that keeps comparing KB to Salvation... you realize that it is an 11pt (13 pt if you spec into residue) Vs a 31pt talent right? If you think they should be equivalent, you are being unreasonable.

 

The reason they are compared is because they're both AoE heals. Beyond that, there is a lot of difference between the two. KB is an up-front instant (not an AoE HoT) whereas Salvation is not (there is an upfront burst, but its an AoE HoT).

 

I don't think anyone is arguing KB should be Salvation's equal in healing power. Most of us are arguing that it should not be limited to 3 people, especially without smart targetting.

[nitrob]

The reason they are compared is because they're both AoE heals. Beyond that, there is a lot of difference between the two. KB is an up-front instant (not an AoE HoT) whereas Salvation is not (there is an upfront burst, but its an AoE HoT).

 

Are you referring to the double tick of the hot? Cause the upfront healing of salvation got removed a couple fixes back. The buggy portion with the double tick is still there, the initial heal from the tooltips and earlier version is gone. The tooltips for salvation don't really match what's in game.

 

FYI, since I like to pvp, I'm more jealous of the Kolto bomb, especially if they get some smarts about who it heals.

Edited February 23, 2012 by nitrob

[RuQu]

Btw everyone that keeps comparing KB to Salvation... you realize that it is an 11pt (13 pt if you spec into residue) Vs a 31pt talent right? If you think they should be equivalent, you are being unreasonable.

 

Kolto Cloud / Recuperative Nanotech is the Scoundrel/Operative 31 pt talent, and their only AoE.

 

Over 30s of AoE healing, optimal per class (ie 3x 10s periods where people can group up for Salv, or 2x periods where Kolto Cloud can heal for 15s without overhealing, or 5x Kolto Bombs that actually heal injured instead of healthy people), these are the breakdowns:

 

Kolto Bomb: 440HPS

Kolto Cloud: 387 HPS

Salvation: 2310 HPS

 

So, if you only want to include 31 pt talents, Salv does 2310 vs 387...

 

Yes, all of them have limitations that will vary from fight to fight. Some fights you won't be able to cluster for 10s, some fights the Kolto Cloud will still be on people who are already topped off (probably by a Sage...), and in many many fights, Kolto Bomb and Kolto Cloud won't heal the people who most need it. The limitations matter, but, I think, the most objective way to compare them is to assume that they heal for the most they possibly can, and then consider how the limitations might effect that.

 

Let's look at them per person per second:

 

KB: 147 HPS/P

KC: 97 HPS/P

Sa: 288 HPS/P

 

97 vs 288, for two 31 pt talents. Guess the Devs disagree about position in the tree mattering too much.

 

Positions in the talent trees aren't particularly important at endgame, as that is only really a guard against hybrid builds taking too many key abilities. At endgame, all AoE abilities need to be able to sustain a group.

 

What holds KB and KC back is largely the player cap, compounded by the inexplicable lack of smart healing. If you lifted the caps, you wouldn't need smart healing, and KB would still heal for 50% of what Salv heals for (over 30s: 5KBs to 3 Salvs, so 30% of Salv per cast), which seems fair considering the buff, instant cast, and the optional DR shield.

[Pantheron]

What they need to do is take our BI at top line and put the kolto bomb there and BI where kolto bomb is. That way I could put those last 6 points into gunnery.

 

On a sidenote, I believe alot of people talking from a pvp perspective have experienced coming into pvp a bit late and meeting good geared players, which pretty much results in getting ***** asap. Only after 14k HP or +300 expertize do we start to work out against a semi-geared team.