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Tip: How I've found groups with PM


Stenrik

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"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

"want to heal...."

 

its getting annoying every fecking minute. When 3 ppl pm u at the same time its starts to annoy

 

every minute ??? Give me a break. I am a healer and I have yet to be PMed.

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Being a mmo has nothing to do with imposing yourself on strangers. Being a mmo does mean that you're in a social environment, and as such you are expected to follow the norms of social ettiquette. You go to any city and just walk up to random strangers and ask them if they want to go do something with you. I'm sure you'll find the odd person that'll be friendly to you, but I'd advise making sure you have some decent health coverage first though.

 

Following the norms of social etiquette means being polite and respectful to people, not ignoring people and becoming angry that someone tried to communicate with you. Have you tried passing somebody on the street and saying hi to them? Nine times out of ten they'll respond with a smile, a wave, or even a return hi. I have never heard of somebody being physically hurt for being nice/pleasent to a complete stranger. Have you?

 

I'm not saying it should only be used by two people that already know each other, but it should be used by two people that are open to knowing each other. As in, I put a looking to sell message in general or trade chat, I expect responses. I put out a LFG message I expect responses, etc etc. Not I rolled a tank, so I expect random PMs the entire time I'm logged in the game. :rolleyes:

 

A better analogy would be two people working at the same company who don't know each other but may be expected to work together. "Person One" - a team leader that "Person Two" doesn't know politely asks "Person Two" if they would like to volunteer for "Person One's" team. Are you saying that "Person Two" should completely ignore "Person One" and everything they say because their words were not expected nor warranted?

 

This isn't reality though (maybe that's the problem with some of you?).

 

On the contrary, social and human interaction is quite real and applicable to this game. If you're rude in-game, if you grief someone or cause some other form of harm then things can be expected to take quite a serious turn. As a random example: Declaring in-game that you're going to bomb the White House. You can be quite sure that will effect you in reality.

 

Oh please. If you're randomly PMing players to fill a group it's all about you. It's for your gain. Maybe not entirely, and maybe the odd person you randomly bother gets some benefit as well, but for all the rest? Ya, you're just spamming them with an offer that is all about your personal gain. Absolutely no different than a gold seller. If a gold seller gets a hit from one of their random PMs, that's someone that want to use that gold sellers services? So both benefit right? ......

 

If somebody PMs you and wants you to do something that will only benefit them, I don't see the harm in being polite and informing them that you aren't available. Now, what if you get a tell from a person who's forming a group for something that would benefit you - well that would be worthwhile to do, now wouldn't it? How many tells do you get a day? Are you really that lazy that you can't be bothered with a sound proposal? And there is a massive difference between a "gold seller" and somebody who is looking for more people for their group. One is trying to sell you their product, while another wants to involve you with a greater social community. I'm going to let you guess what's what.

 

You wrote this, and you talk to me about seeking professional help? lololol

 

I did, and I still stand by that statement. You seem like a very close minded individual who is prone to making hyperbolic statements at will and are very anti-social in a very social setting. You also haven't answered my last statement (perhaps because you can't) as to you talking to random people online that you've never met.

 

I don't know you, who are you? I never solicited your attention, why are you talking to me? Are you trying to get something from me? What are you selling?

 

How rude of you to not consider my feelings first.

 

/Ignore

 

Oh, and sarcasm aside here are a few links you might find useful:

 

Telemarketing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telemarketing

 

Social interaction: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_interaction

 

Rudeness (I like this one): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rude

 

Rudeness (also called impudence or effrontery) is a display of disrespect by not complying with the social "laws" or etiquette of a group or culture. These laws have been established as the essential boundaries of normally accepted behavior. To be unable or unwilling to align one's behavior with these laws known to the general population of what is socially acceptable is to be rude.

 

Rudeness "constituted by deviation from whatever counts as politic in a given social context, is inherently confrontational and disruptive to social equilibrium" (Kasper, 1990, p. 208). Rudeness, particularly with respect to speech, is necessarily confrontational at its core.

 

Similar terms include: impoliteness, making a faux pas, insensitivity, offensiveness, obscenity, profanity, violating taboos, and deviancy. In some cases, criminal behavior can also be an act of rudeness.

 

Kind of sounds like you're your own victim, doesn't it?

Edited by pursang
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Oddly I'm starting to see a correlation here.Seems like NICE people dont mind getting PMs while antisocial people have a problem with it.Its a win-win any way you look at it because some people insist on being miserable no matter what.You can see the difference in their replies.

 

You know you can just turn the chat window off...that shouldnt be a problem for you since you dont want to be bothered anyway.

So people that believe that randomly PMing strangers is rude are not "nice" people? Funny, for what you're intimating as a "anti-social" person, I sure do have some rather large friends lists in the games I play. You know what a friends list is right? That's the list of people that you have opened yourself up to receiving random PMs from......

 

Oh and do you really want a recap of this thread to see just who started not being "nice" in their responses?

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It is entirely rude. You're using a feature that is intended for private conversations between two people that both know each other, and both consent to communicate with each other. You're directly imposing yourself on complete strangers for your personal gain. You're no different from the gold sellers that randomly PM people. That's why people get offended and put you on ignore. Most gold sellers are extremely polite in their PMs, so that makes it ok?

 

Try being a tank, or a healer, and see just how open you are to random PMs from people wanting to know if you'll join their group. :rolleyes:

 

You're aware this is the method that was used initially on mmos before someone came up with the idea for a dungeon finder, right? I couldn't even begin to count the number of tells I got on my priest in vanilla WoW asking if I'd be interested in a dungeon. The only thing that makes it rude is if they persist after I've refused, argue with me, or the tone of their request is rude from the start. Man, dungeon finder really spoiled some people.

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(sigh). Have fun with your games, as a suggestion though. It just seems crazy how some people genuinely want to help people out only to get smashed by waves of spergetastic responses.

 

*Doubleshootyfingers*

 

"Spergatastic" I like this word. If it isn't in the dictionary it should be. :D

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I miss getting random PM's, those were the days. :D

 

Personally, if you add a little spice to a general message your results will improve. I've found it especially effective to threaten to kick a puppy in the face if 4 BAMF do not join my group. By the time I've polished my steel toe boots and strapped them on I usually have a group ready.

 

Only once have I had to kick the puppy. :cool:

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That's why a global version of the LFG listing tool we have would be so important. It doesn't need to be an auto-matcher or anything like that (think WoW 2.0 rather than WoW 3.3). But the 50s on Fleet seem to be more likely to be already doing something, or about to do something.

 

I don't now if this was replied to but the lfg flag is global already. All you have to do is put 'lfg' in the search box in /who and it will return everyone that has flagged themselves as looking for a group no matter where they are. You can be more specific too by searching for multiple things such as lfg and level. It won't search for the contents of the lfg box though so you can't put in there a specific flashpoint or role or something that people can search for.

 

Of course it doesn't help that those sitting around in the fleet spamming /1 don't actually bother to flag themselves lfg to begin with.

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I've had a large number of people sand me replies "You are now going on ignore" doing this, and then the rest of the time no response at all. Randomly PMing people is very rude.

 

Not to mention that it's rather presumptuous to assume that all Sages are healers. I'd feel inclined to add them to ignore for that alone.

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Following the norms of social etiquette means being polite and respectful to people, not ignoring people and becoming angry that someone tried to communicate with you. Have you tried passing somebody on the street and saying hi to them? Nine times out of ten they'll respond with a smile, a wave, or even a return hi. I have never heard of somebody being physically hurt for being nice/pleasent to a complete stranger. Have you?
heh, you're really trying, but are you really going to insult the intelligence of the people on these forums by trying to meld this into just a "being nice to complete strangers" issue? That isn't what we're talking about here. What we're talking about here is randomly PMing complete strangers to help you achieve something you want to achieve. You're doing it for your gain. You want to throw up real life so often? Ok, let's do that? In real life? You're soliciting. How many cities, towns, municipalities, districts, counties, states, provinces, etc etc etc have laws on their books about random solicitation in the streets? How many buildings do you walk up to in a day that have a sign on their main door stating, emphatically, "No Solicitors"? Boy, the whole world is just plain anti-social and not nice because they don't want Mr. Randomdude bothering them with random offers. /sarcasmoff

 

If somebody PMs you and wants you to do something that will only benefit them, I don't see the harm in being polite and informing them that you aren't available.
Funny, the producers of this game, and pretty much every mmo out there, seem to disagree with you. Thus why gold sellers that send random PMs to people get banned.

 

Now, what if you get a tell from a person who's forming a group for something that would benefit you - well that would be worthwhile to do, now wouldn't it?
Except, you have no idea whether or not the person you're randomly PMing will benefit. You're shooting in the dark with random PMs to complete strangers for what is to most of the people something that only benefits you. You're no different that those companies that call people's houses while they're eating dinner.

 

How many tells do you get a day? Are you really that lazy that you can't be bothered with a sound proposal?
Lazy? Really? You're going to go there? Because I may not want my proper chats, those being with people that I have opened myself up to chatting with, getting continually interrupted by lines of text from people I don't know from a hole in the ground, then I'm lazy? Just how far are you willing to stretch to try and win some debate on an internet forum anyway? I'm betting you really have never come to that limit have you? lol

 

And there is a massive difference between a "gold seller" and somebody who is looking for more people for their group. One is trying to sell you their product, while another wants to involve you with a greater social community.
heh, here's the "wanting to involve you in the greater social community" again. Shouldn't when and where I get "involved in the greater social community" be my choice, not yours?

 

 

 

I did, and I still stand by that statement. You seem like a very close minded individual who is prone to make hyperbolic statements at will and are very anti-social in a very social setting. You also haven't answered my last statement (perhaps because you can't) as to you talking to random people online that you've never met.

 

I don't know you, who are you? I never solicited your attention, why are you talking to me? Are you trying to get something from me? What are you selling?

 

How rude of you to not consider my feelings first.

 

/Ignore

 

Oh, and sarcasm aside here are a few links you might find useful:

I'll answer it. I'll answer it in the form of inviting you to do an experiment. This will also maybe make you understand the difference between posting on a forum, and randomly PMing complete strangers. You go ahead and start randomly PMing people on these forums. Now for me it'll work out fine, because it won't be too long before I'm not debating with you, but for you? It probably won't work out so goo. That being due to how soon you'll first get a warning from the mods, and then if you continue you'll get banned.

 

Telemarketing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telemarketing

 

Social interaction: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_interaction

 

Rudeness (I like this one): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rude

 

 

 

Kind of sounds like you're your own victim, doesn't it?

Thanks for making my points for me. Did you actually read what you linked there? :D

 

That's just too funny. Thanks for a good chuckle anyway.

Edited by Umbral
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You're aware this is the method that was used initially on mmos before someone came up with the idea for a dungeon finder, right? I couldn't even begin to count the number of tells I got on my priest in vanilla WoW asking if I'd be interested in a dungeon. The only thing that makes it rude is if they persist after I've refused, argue with me, or the tone of their request is rude from the start. Man, dungeon finder really spoiled some people.
You do know that you're entirely wrong right? People spammed their LFG messages in chat channels, not PMed random strangers. Again, just because you don't think it's rude doesn't mean it's ok to do.
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Of course it doesn't help that those sitting around in the fleet spamming /1 don't actually bother to flag themselves lfg to begin with.

 

Yes, I've never quite understood why hardly anyone uses it.

 

About group invite whispers - no, I don't find it rude at all. What I find rude is when i get the group invite popup without a whisper first, so I don't know what they're inviting me to. When that happened I wasn't even flagged as LFG. Those I will automatically decline, just as I used to with silent guild invites. It doesn't seem to happen as often here as with some other games though.

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I've had a large number of people sand me replies "You are now going on ignore" doing this, and then the rest of the time no response at all. Randomly PMing people is very rude.

 

I do this all the time and the only responses I ever get are either yes or no. I always thank them either way and I never PM them more than once if they don't respond, I move on.

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You do know that you're entirely wrong right? People spammed their LFG messages in chat channels, not PMed random strangers. Again, just because you don't think it's rude doesn't mean it's ok to do.

 

After all your responses, I'm just really glad that I'll most likely never end up in a group with you.

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Yes, I've never quite understood why hardly anyone uses it.

 

About group invite whispers - no, I don't find it rude at all. What I find rude is when i get the group invite popup without a whisper first, so I don't know what they're inviting me to. When that happened I wasn't even flagged as LFG. Those I will automatically decline, just as I used to with silent guild invites. It doesn't seem to happen as often here as with some other games though.

 

^ this, a thousand times this.

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If randomly PMing people is rude.. Then so is asking out a girl you don't know!

We would all not be here if that where rude :D

 

I'm a healer myself and often get PM'd for invites. Most of the time i'm busy but it has never bothered me EXCEPT if a PM resembles the following line

 

"hi m8, u healzor FE HM for us yes? kthnxsbai"

 

Any normaly written PM will get a reply (unless I realy dont see it which can happen)

 

Most of the Tanks on my friends list got there by a PM to start with :p

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Yes, I've never quite understood why hardly anyone uses it.

 

About group invite whispers - no, I don't find it rude at all. What I find rude is when i get the group invite popup without a whisper first, so I don't know what they're inviting me to. When that happened I wasn't even flagged as LFG. Those I will automatically decline, just as I used to with silent guild invites. It doesn't seem to happen as often here as with some other games though.

 

Yeah the problem with the LFG system is it's too passive.

Nobody uses it because... nobody else uses it!

 

And general is spammy so many turn it off or ignore it, even though they'd still group if invited. That's why PM works in the first place, right?

 

I have an alternate idea: 3 SEPARATE LFI (looking for individual) channels. Looking for tank, looking for healer, and looking for dps. That way players can filter out the spam of "/1." and focus on messages just aimed at their role. So healers could turn on the "LFH" channel. There would also be a regular LFG channel, for individuals looking for groups.

Edited by Stenrik
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Oh, and btw, since you know, I've seen a few posts from people hinting that this is partly a "veterans of the genre don't mind getting random PMs" thing, can anyone here tell us when the fist /ignore function was implemented in a mmorpg?

 

You see I know because I was actually there at the time.

 

Here I'll just tell you.

 

It was 1999, not long after UO implemented their in-game chat system.

 

What was the primary reason for the /ignore function?

 

The numbers of messages from crafters and gatherers sending PMs to random strangers trying to sell their wares was starting to drive players crazy.

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It is entirely rude. You're using a feature that is intended for private conversations between two people that both know each other, and both consent to communicate with each other. You're directly imposing yourself on complete strangers for your personal gain. You're no different from the gold sellers that randomly PM people. That's why people get offended and put you on ignore. Most gold sellers are extremely polite in their PMs, so that makes it ok?

 

Try being a tank, or a healer, and see just how open you are to random PMs from people wanting to know if you'll join their group. :rolleyes:

 

Actually, a PM with /tell or /whisper is intended for a private conversation between two people rather than a public conversation using /say. There is no need for them to know each other, so your definition is too narrow.

 

It's the content of the communication (what is said) and not its method (/tell or /say) which determines if it's rude. So I welcome PM requests for groups or help so long as they are polite (beginning with a greeting such as hello is always a plus) and are not repeated to the point of harassment.

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Actually, a PM with /tell or /whisper is intended for a private conversation between two people rather than a public conversation using /say. There is no need for them to know each other, so your definition is too narrow.
You mean, there is no need as far as you're concerned, right?
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Biodrone detected.

It is a sensible approach. I'm a sage healer, I get PMs all the time. I have no problem saying, 'Nope, not at this time, but I'm a healer. Add me to your friends list and PM me next time." I'm not sure why you scoff at the idea.

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