Huge autocannon for commando, rifle for vanguard ?

[Enako]

We have huge autocannons for commandos, who are a version of a trooper which is supposed to be dropped behind enemy lines and operate away from supply lines, with limited ammunition/energy/whatever,

 

but, we have mere Rifles for vanguards, which is a role that is supposed to run in front of the army, with all the supporting units and equipment that goes with it.

 

not to mention that weight is always an issue when you are doing dropoffs, not only for the vehicle, but also for the paratroopers/commandos being dropped. even if you are in a power armor, if you are away from supplies, you need to be careful with the energy you spend.

 

...............

 

wouldnt it be more logical and realistic if vanguards, who are the spearheads of the army, to use huge, energy-guzzling autocannons, and commandos, who are dropped behind enemy lines without supply lines, use purpose-built, light and small blaster rifles ?

[Pubsam]

Hard to imagine a Vanguard would be very mobile carrying around 30 pounds of gun.

[Tareel]

Hard to imagine a Vanguard would be very mobile carrying around 30 pounds of gun.

 

I think OP is trying to that the Commando is supposed to be mobile and the Vanguard not so much. I agree, I think the Vanguard needs the cannon and the Commando needs the rifle. Makes more sense. But to be honest, I wish we just had a choice, I like the cannon, but I want a rifle to. BW needs to make our skills not be weapon dependant.

[Enako]

Hard to imagine a Vanguard would be very mobile carrying around 30 pounds of gun.

 

I think OP is trying to that the Commando is supposed to be mobile and the Vanguard not so much. I agree, I think the Vanguard needs the cannon and the Commando needs the rifle. Makes more sense. But to be honest, I wish we just had a choice, I like the cannon, but I want a rifle to. BW needs to make our skills not be weapon dependant.

 

quite.

 

vanguard has a whole army unit behind him/her. commando is behind enemy lines.

[Pubsam]

I think OP is trying to that the Commando is supposed to be mobile and the Vanguard not so much. I agree, I think the Vanguard needs the cannon and the Commando needs the rifle. Makes more sense. But to be honest, I wish we just had a choice, I like the cannon, but I want a rifle to. BW needs to make our skills not be weapon dependant.

 

Huh? I know the OP is talking about Commandos and Vanguards in an RP sense, but in this game, Vanguards are the mobile ones. They use mostly instant attacks designed for CQC, and control movement on the battlefield via Storm and Harpoon. Nobody is literally leaping into battle lugging an assault cannon. Commandos attacks mostly have a charge time, and in this game are more immobile turrets dishing out destruction from afar.

[Tareel]

Huh? I know the OP is talking about Commandos and Vanguards in an RP sense, but in this game, Vanguards are the mobile ones. They use mostly instant attacks designed for CQC, and control movement on the battlefield via Storm and Harpoon. Nobody is literally leaping into battle lugging an assault cannon. Commandos attacks mostly have a charge time, and in this game are more immobile turrets dishing out destruction from afar.

 

Thats fine and dandy but your one sentence reply made it seem like you had no idea what he was talking about.

[VixsAU]

Applying 2012 Earth logic to the Star Wars universe is bound to lead to frustration.

 

I would imagine with an entire galaxy of resources to draw on, and technology to utilise, assault cannons are actually relatively light-weight, and ammunition is not limited by physical capacity to carry more 'cells', but rather a perpetually self-replenishing resource that needs only time without use to restore itself.

 

Think of the most impressive technological advancements we are working on, then imagine that in the Star Wars universe they have been achieved and perfected.

 

I also find everything is more awesome when I think of it like this

[Kaigen]

One thing to keep in mind is that blasters are portrayed in Star Wars as having very deep "clips." Different expanded universe sources have had different ideas as to how far these extend, but in the movies, you never see people with blasters counting "bullets" swapping out "clips" or running dry (unless you count the Ewok Adventure movie).

[Phalynn]

Agree w/ OP. I was all about VG until I saw that they dont get the Asslt Cannons. Deal-Breaker....currently getting a CMDO to 50

[Gabriah]

Vanguards use Commando Mods, while Commandos use Reflex Mods.

[Daekarus]

It's weird that people like one or the other... doesn't anybody like both? I have a Vanguard, but in my alt plans is a commando, and I think each is appropriate for each... why the drama? They're both cool...

[Enako]

Applying 2012 Earth logic to the Star Wars universe is bound to lead to frustration.

 

I would imagine with an entire galaxy of resources to draw on, and technology to utilise, assault cannons are actually relatively light-weight, and ammunition is not limited by physical capacity to carry more 'cells', but rather a perpetually self-replenishing resource that needs only time without use to restore itself.

 

if it was so, all soldiers would be using autocannons. there would be no point to using a rifle instead of an autocannon.

[tobarstep]

Huh? I know the OP is talking about Commandos and Vanguards in an RP sense, but in this game, Vanguards are the mobile ones. They use mostly instant attacks designed for CQC, and control movement on the battlefield via Storm and Harpoon. Nobody is literally leaping into battle lugging an assault cannon. Commandos attacks mostly have a charge time, and in this game are more immobile turrets dishing out destruction from afar.

 

It's not so much an RP or mechanics issue as a semantic one. If you look up what the terms commando and vanguard refer to (and I think this was the OP's point), you'll see that Bioware pretty much got them reversed with regard to weapon choice. It's mostly a cosmetic thing anyway. All they'd have to do is say, "Ok, X skill no longer requires Y weapon, and now does n-nn damage" and problem solved.

[SirHaggis]

We have huge autocannons for commandos, who are a version of a trooper which is supposed to be dropped behind enemy lines and operate away from supply lines, with limited ammunition/energy/whatever,

 

As a commando I do that all the time. And with all my alts. In fact that is a pretty good definition for all MMO Characters.

 

Is commando the perfect name for the class, no. But heavy weapons guy is a bit much so we use it.

 

It's not so much an RP or mechanics issue as a semantic one. If you look up what the terms commando and vanguard refer to (and I think this was the OP's point), you'll see that Bioware pretty much got them reversed with regard to weapon choice. It's mostly a cosmetic thing anyway. All they'd have to do is say, "Ok, X skill no longer requires Y weapon, and now does n-nn damage" and problem solved.

 

As a tank the vanguard often goes into close combat. The Rifle is the much better choice for that. Commando is turret. Fits cannon to a tee.

Edited January 27, 2012 by SirHaggis

[VixsAU]

if it was so, all soldiers would be using autocannons. there would be no point to using a rifle instead of an autocannon.

 

That's not necessarily going to be true. Blaster rifles would likely have much greater accuracy and usability, blaster pistols are much more practical for up close fighting, sniper rifles still provide unmatched precision at range.

 

You wouldn't kick in a door with an assault cannon, you'd let the guys with the blaster rifles and pistols charge in first.

 

Everything has its place.

[Enako]

That's not necessarily going to be true. Blaster rifles would likely have much greater accuracy and usability, blaster pistols are much more practical for up close fighting, sniper rifles still provide unmatched precision at range.

 

You wouldn't kick in a door with an assault cannon, you'd let the guys with the blaster rifles and pistols charge in first.

 

Everything has its place.

 

in a carnal battlefield, accuracy comes after than firepower. and in environments in which you are dropped off enemy lines, accuracy is much more important.

[tobarstep]

As a tank the vanguard often goes into close combat. The Rifle is the much better choice for that. Commando is turret. Fits cannon to a tee.

 

But you're talking game mechanics, not the meanings of the words, which is what I was referring to.

[SirHaggis]

But you're talking game mechanics, not the meanings of the words, which is what I was referring to.

 

We're talking look and feel. Your comparing look and feel of the weapon to the name i'm comparing it the fighting style.

[Vilkaz]

i cant imagine vanguard chanring forwards and smashing his gun in enemy faces, while using mansbig gatlinggun o_O

 

vanguards are very mobile units, and are allways trying to

 

high five !

in your face !

With my gun !

 

do this with gatling

[tobarstep]

We're talking look and feel. Your comparing look and feel of the weapon to the name i'm comparing it the fighting style.

 

In a way, but in the sense that the look and feel don't match with the names of the classes. It would be like reversing the class names of operative and sniper.

[MeanMartian]

if it was so, all soldiers would be using autocannons. there would be no point to using a rifle instead of an autocannon.

 

Not necessarily. The autocannon requires that the user brace and steady himself for its most powerful shots, not because of its weight, but because of the energy release of those shots. The rifle, not having access to the same level of output, allows for a more mobile use while potentially weighing about the same.

 

As for the original poster's suggestion that these two names are wrong for RP reasons. I respond thus. Game design takes precedence over RP concerns. They decided to make autocannon class ranged dps. They decided to make the rifle class mostly melee/some range class to allow for more varied play styles. They decided to couple the tanking spec with the primarily melee class. They decided to name the advanced class that could tank Vanguard. These choices, while I'm not sure which order they were made in, were all made for game mechanic reasons and RP had nothing to do with it.

[PederB]

commando [kuh-man-doh]

1. To not wear undergarments.

 

Clearly the guy with the big gun.

[fuzzybob]

Most artillery needs to be set up to fire and is behind the front lines and the m119 has a range of about 19 miles for a 105mm shell, an abrams tank is faster small shell size not sure on what size, but can shoot on the move and a 119 or paladin so howitzer can not

[Nicothemic]

Well, Bioware seems to not be very firm about the terms, since there's the whole issue with vanguards using "commando" and "supercommando" gear and commandos using whatever-the-heck-they-call-it gear - BW probably just picked two military terms and weren't sure which AC to give what name until late in the developement.

 

All in all, I'm more fine with vanguards being vanguards, since we often DO charge first into the fight with the rest coming behind us - however, the term "commando" sort of carries with it a certain level of sneakyness, which doesn't really fit either of the trooper ACs.

 

So yes, Commandos should probably be called "Heavy Weapons Specialists" or something, but since that is too long, they are commandos. I sure can't come up with a better alternative.

[uramu]

Agree w/ OP. I was all about VG until I saw that they dont get the Asslt Cannons. Deal-Breaker....currently getting a CMDO to 50

 

Kinda hate to admit it, but that's why I chose Commando as well. Half the reason I went Trooper was the AC, the other half was the armor. BH healing Merc was the first class I rolled, but I absolutely hated the healing mechanics and re-rolled an Op healer instead. Because my Imp main is an Op, I wanted a change from Blaster Rifles - no Trooper tank for me ... very disappointing since I assumed the hulking brute tank type would naturally be the one using the BFG.

 

I see both sides of this argument, but I think the poster who said we should have a choice of either gun made the most sense. I love so much about this game, but being a Spec Ops guy whose choice of role is dependent upon his weapon doesn't make much sense to me. Spec Ops are often the insanely talented with unconventional methods type of people.