nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 annnddd.....here we go. another reason why i dont want arenas implemented. just to punish a-hats like this guy. not saying that whole arena crowd are like him, but dear lord are they an epidemic. nearly half of the pro arena posters have been elitist jerks* *disclaimer: this is no way reflects upon pro arena posters that have been considerate and not resorted to these scumbag tactics. Except for the parts about baddies, he has a valid point. If you're good, gear isn't the issue. And most of the people who put the time and effort into getting that ranking and gear don't do Random Battlegrounds/Warzones/Whatever you call it. They do Arenas and Rated Warzones (again, against people as geared as them). In WoW you could get the same gear from Rated BGs so the only people who had a problem with it were the people who only queue for Randoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 annnddd.....here we go. another reason why i dont want arenas implemented. just to punish a-hats like this guy. not saying that whole arena crowd are like him, but dear lord are they an epidemic. nearly half of the pro arena posters have been elitist jerks* *disclaimer: this is no way reflects upon pro arena posters that have been considerate and not resorted to these scumbag tactics. I know what you mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holocroncrystal Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) WOW forced people to do arena and deal with those elitest additudes instead of playing with friends and having fun your partners became nothing more then skill based. If the people that are so bad and others so good why make it harder for those who aren't so good to get the same gear? It's like saying I'm godly skilled but I don't want to fight people that have the same gear as me, I want to depive those lesser so I can more easly roll them quicker. If you have two equally skilled people the one with better gear will win, or the class that is more over powerd. My point is you shouldn't be punished for playing with friends and balancing issues, in which evey mmo suffers from balancing issues, it's no easy task to fix. Thats probaply why WOW changed things. Lets not follow WOWs mistakes lets learn from them, it's cheaper aswell. Edited January 25, 2012 by Holocroncrystal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 annnddd.....here we go. another reason why i dont want arenas implemented. just to punish a-hats like this guy. not saying that whole arena crowd are like him, but dear lord are they an epidemic. nearly half of the pro arena posters have been elitist jerks* *disclaimer: this is no way reflects upon pro arena posters that have been considerate and not resorted to these scumbag tactics. ANNDDD that is a reason I strayed from PVE, because of individuals such as yourself. I can be respectful and have been for the most part. However, it gets annoying seeing people like yourself say I don't like arenas because a certain personality type gravitates towards arenas. Seeing people say that gear imbalances were the reason they failed at arena is bad. They were bad at arenas because they either didn't put enough effort into them or didn't like the playstyle of arenas and only did them for gear or simply couldn't grasp how to properly play them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarylMusashi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I'd be ok with arenas if they do not have a gear chase associated with them. I hate pvp gear chases. Just let people enter pvp pretty much on equal footing. The truly good pvp players do not need a stupid gear advantage to excel, and lesser experienced players can actually spend time learning to pvp rather than chase gear for months just to then start learning how to pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Except for the parts about baddies, he has a valid point. If you're good, gear isn't the issue. And most of the people who put the time and effort into getting that ranking and gear don't do Random Battlegrounds/Warzones/Whatever you call it. They do Arenas and Rated Warzones (again, against people as geared as them). In WoW you could get the same gear from Rated BGs so the only people who had a problem with it were the people who only queue for Randoms. Again, it comes down to gear. A seperate gear system, right? With better stats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryotknife Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Except for the parts about baddies, he has a valid point. If you're good, gear isn't the issue. And most of the people who put the time and effort into getting that ranking and gear don't do Random Battlegrounds/Warzones/Whatever you call it. They do Arenas and Rated Warzones (again, against people as geared as them). In WoW you could get the same gear from Rated BGs so the only people who had a problem with it were the people who only queue for Randoms. in terms of gear.....it depends. a new weapon can make a huge difference for melee classes in wow (rogues/wars in particular) if say you were using S5 gear and your opponent was using S6, unless that S6 came with a nifty bonus he will only have a slight advantage over you. but more than that there was a big difference, and in wow towards...wotlk i believe (around the time i quit)....there could easily be a 2-3 tier difference in gear if you didnt play arenas. Edited January 25, 2012 by Ryotknife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 WOW forced people to do arena and deal with those elitest additudes instead of playing with friends and having fun your partners became nothing more then skill based. If the people that are so bad and others so good why make it harder for those who aren't so good to get the same gear? It's like saying I'm godly skilled but I don't want to fight people that have the same gear as me, I want to depive those lesser so I can more easly roll them quicker. If you have two equally skilled people the one with better gear will win, or the class that is more over powerd. My point is you shouldn't be punished for playing with friends and balancing issues, in which evey mmo suffers from balancing issues, it's no easy task to fix. First off, if you're bad at PvP, you should know arenas aren't your thing. Second, it didn't force anything. I got the exact same gear as you get from arenas by doing Rated Battlegrounds with...wait for it...my friends! And we had fun too! Why is it harder for bad players to get gear? Because they're bad and you DO have to PvP to get PvP gear. Even casual random BGs make it harder on bads to get gear by saying if you lose, you get a lot less Honor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noxxia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I say expand huttball with at *least* 2 more maps and turn that into SWTOR's "Arena". I dislike the idea of last man standing because it'll just become a heal off and you'll sit around the whole time while one team controls the ball. The objective of scoring is great. That being said huttball could use some improvements. 1) figure out a way to reset after scoring. It seems after one team scores twice it becomes very challenging for the team that is behind to come back. a good 1-1 2-2 game is possible, and yeah, it is possible to come back, but very hard since the team who scored can be ready to pick up the ball immediately and already have guys up field to pass to. I would say void star style reset with a 5 second countdown, that also pauses the game time until the 5 seconds releases. think hockey. 2) Allow ops of 8 to queue, but only queue them against other ops of 8. This would be great to implement cross servers seeing as smaller servers would see the same 2 or 3 teams over and over. 3) Allow spectator for the above. just pick from a list of games currently being played. SImilar to Dota 2 spectator (including the delay) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 WOW forced people to do arena and deal with those elitest additudes instead of playing with friends and having fun your partners became nothing more then skill based. If the people that are so bad and others so good why make it harder for those who aren't so good to get the same gear? It's like saying I'm godly skilled but I don't want to fight people that have the same gear as me, I want to depive those lesser so I can more easly roll them quicker. If you have two equally skilled people the one with better gear will win, or the class that is more over powerd. My point is you shouldn't be punished for playing with friends and balancing issues, in which evey mmo suffers from balancing issues, it's no easy task to fix. Whooo dude, no one forced anyone to do arenas in wow! The only thing that 'forced' anyone to play arenas is some neurotic delusion that having the best pvp gear in a video game somehow ment something or that you were somehow better than someone else at a video game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 WOW forced people to do arena and deal with those elitest additudes instead of playing with friends and having fun your partners became nothing more then skill based. If the people that are so bad and others so good why make it harder for those who aren't so good to get the same gear? It's like saying I'm godly skilled but I don't want to fight people that have the same gear as me, I want to depive those lesser so I can more easly roll them quicker. If you have two equally skilled people the one with better gear will win, or the class that is more over powerd. My point is you shouldn't be punished for playing with friends and balancing issues, in which evey mmo suffers from balancing issues, it's no easy task to fix. Look I don't have a problem with people having the same gear. I do however have a problem with people complaining that they can't get said gear because they are already at a gear deficit. When i stopped playing WOW I believe 2150 got you all your gear, that ranking was not hard to achieve for most people with a basic fundamental knowledge of how to play arenas. The gear was just a carrot on a stick to people who wanted good gear with minimal effort, and suprise when they found out you actually have to put some amount of effort to get that gear they get angry. They find a reason to blame their failures on others despite the fact that they just weren't simply good enough at arenas to get there. The real gear problem with arenas were several PVE peices (glaives in s3) that were really unbalancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryotknife Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 First off, if you're bad at PvP, you should know arenas aren't your thing. Second, it didn't force anything. I got the exact same gear as you get from arenas by doing Rated Battlegrounds with...wait for it...my friends! And we had fun too! Why is it harder for bad players to get gear? Because they're bad and you DO have to PvP to get PvP gear. Even casual random BGs make it harder on bads to get gear by saying if you lose, you get a lot less Honor. wow definitely forced arenas down peoples throats. most of the people who played arena didnt even enjoy it. this is why the arena population tanked horribly from bc to wotlk. i believe the arena population decreased by something like 75% at one point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redderic Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Bioware needs to be original...too late dude. Except for the story and voice acting it's pretty much WoW in space. Only PvPing in WoW doesn't make you a real PvPer huh? Pray tell what does? I'm pretty sure playing multiple games and saying "yeah, I did PvP in all of them" isn't on the list of qualifications. i loled irl at this with the thought that I have been in the Army for 6 years now and have deployed to Iraq. Im currently an Infantryman and have been since i joined right after highschool. Does that make me an IRL pvper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) wow definitely forced arenas down peoples throats. most of the people who played arena didnt even enjoy it. this is why the arena population tanked horribly from bc to wotlk. i believe the arena population decreased by something like 75% at one point? What part of you could do RBGs to get the EXACT SAME gear did you miss? Get the welfare set from casual random BGs and then go RBG. Easy enough, that's how I did it. Edited January 25, 2012 by nschlan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarylMusashi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 First off, if you're bad at PvP, you should know arenas aren't your thing. Second, it didn't force anything. I got the exact same gear as you get from arenas by doing Rated Battlegrounds with...wait for it...my friends! And we had fun too! Why is it harder for bad players to get gear? Because they're bad and you DO have to PvP to get PvP gear. Even casual random BGs make it harder on bads to get gear by saying if you lose, you get a lot less Honor. They're "bad" because they have to spend too much time trying to chase down gear rather than just going for it. The reason arenas have such small participation in Warcraft is for exactly this reason. People have to spend too much time chasing the gear to even think about competing. They don't get to learn anything useful being hopelessly outmatched in the gear department except how to handle getting roflstomped all the time. Most people try at first, then quit participating when they realize that they will never have a decent shot until the get the gear which will take far too long so the fun factor disappears like a fart in the wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Look I don't have a problem with people having the same gear. I do however have a problem with people complaining that they can't get said gear because they are already at a gear deficit. When i stopped playing WOW I believe 2150 got you all your gear, that ranking was not hard to achieve for most people with a basic fundamental knowledge of how to play arenas. The gear was just a carrot on a stick to people who wanted good gear with minimal effort, and suprise when they found out you actually have to put some amount of effort to get that gear they get angry. They find a reason to blame their failures on others despite the fact that they just weren't simply good enough at arenas to get there. The real gear problem with arenas were several PVE peices (glaives in s3) that were really unbalancing. Fair point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) They're "bad" because they have to spend too much time trying to chase down gear rather than just going for it. The reason arenas have such small participation in Warcraft is for exactly this reason. People have to spend too much time chasing the gear to even think about competing. They don't get to learn anything useful being hopelessly outmatched in the gear department except how to handle getting roflstomped all the time. Most people try at first, then quit participating when they realize that they will never have a decent shot until the get the gear which will take far too long so the fun factor disappears like a fart in the wind. That's not true at all. I got my first toon to max lvl withing the last 3 weeks of that season. By the end of the season I had ~2250 rating. It's not hard, especially since they give you a welfare set to start out that is not that bad. Edited January 25, 2012 by nschlan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 They're "bad" because they have to spend too much time trying to chase down gear rather than just going for it. The reason arenas have such small participation in Warcraft is for exactly this reason. People have to spend too much time chasing the gear to even think about competing. They don't get to learn anything useful being hopelessly outmatched in the gear department except how to handle getting roflstomped all the time. Most people try at first, then quit participating when they realize that they will never have a decent shot until the get the gear which will take far too long so the fun factor disappears like a fart in the wind. They are bad because they dont understand how arenas work. What type of mistakes they can capitalize on. I don't know how it is now but blizzard specifically introduced a MMR system so that a) people could sell glad as easily and b) to prevent overly geared and way better opponents to run rampant and cause kids to rage in the lower brackets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarylMusashi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hearken back to the days of Street Fighter and Tekken, real PvP games in the 90s. That guy that whipped everyone daily in the arcade didn't need a special set of gear to make him have a huge advantage over the casual players that stepped up to try their luck. But every now and then, a casual player would practice up, and pull an upset. He didn't have to first spend several weeks to months grinding away for gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holocroncrystal Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) First off, if you're bad at PvP, you should know arenas aren't your thing. Second, it didn't force anything. I got the exact same gear as you get from arenas by doing Rated Battlegrounds with...wait for it...my friends! And we had fun too! Why is it harder for bad players to get gear? Because they're bad and you DO have to PvP to get PvP gear. Even casual random BGs make it harder on bads to get gear by saying if you lose, you get a lot less Honor. To get the best PVP gear yes you were forced to play. I don't choose my friends by their skill level. Not every one was lesser skilled they were playing catch up to get the better gear. And that catch race only made the community more elitist. WOW changed it anyways and it was for the better. I have no problem with with rated WZ's or BG's. I have a problem with options on how to obtain that gear. Edited January 25, 2012 by Holocroncrystal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 They are bad because they dont understand how arenas work. What type of mistakes they can capitalize on. I don't know how it is now but blizzard specifically introduced a MMR system so that a) people could sell glad as easily and b) to prevent overly geared and way better opponents to run rampant and cause kids to rage in the lower brackets. Exactly. With MMR, odds were, most teams you went up against had about the same level of gear as you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 To get the best PVP gear yes you were forced to play. I don't choose my friends by their skill level. Not every one was lesser skilled they were playing catch up to get the better gear to catch up and it only made the community more elitist. WOW changed it anyways and it was for the better. You were NOT forced to arena. RATED BATTLEGROUNDS gave the SAME GEAR. Id it that hard to comprehend? I didn't choose my friends on skill either, they just happened to not be scrubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarylMusashi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 That's not true at all. I got my first toon to max lvl withing the last 3 weeks of that season. By the end of the season I had ~2250 rating. It's not hard, especially since they give you a welfare set to start out that is not that bad. What you are doing is called "projection". Your situation does not make a one size fits all situation. It is hard for most people. You have to take into account the greater good, and the better potential for profit for the company. More people participating and having a good time equals more dollars for Bioware to improve the game. Besides, I smell a lot of fear from some of you that an equal gear footing will crack the illusion of what great players you claim to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryotknife Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) What part of you could do RBGs to get the EXACT SAME gear did you miss? Get the welfare set from casual random BGs and then go RBG. Easy enough, that's how I did it. rbgs may not be a feasible option as they require so many people. and, thanks to arenas and the mentality they created, once again you could only go as X spec, especially if you try to join a trade chat pug. it was common for even trade chat formed rbgs to outright refuse to accept entire classes. hell i had a hard time getting my 3v3 team to play every week. Edited January 25, 2012 by Ryotknife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 To get the best PVP gear yes you were forced to play. I don't choose my friends by their skill level. Not every one was lesser skilled they were playing catch up to get the better gear to catch up and it only made the community more elitist. WOW changed it anyways and it was for the better. This is wh y I say the same PvP gear for ALL pvp events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts