Yfelsung Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 English is my first and only fluent language, so I've never had problems with English terms such as "up to" or "may". Now, I'm assuming a lot of you must be ESL speakers (English as a second language) so I'm trying to figure out what terminology could be used to help you understand the English concept of "up to". In English, up to is a phrase used to indicate an indefinite number with a definite maximum. For example, if I were to pay you "up to 5 dollars" to mow my lawn, I could pay you any amount from 1 cent to 5 dollars. If I were to be at a party "up to" 10 oclock, I could leave that party at any point before 10 oclock and would still be accurate. Up to can also sometimes be used similar to "around" or "approximately". Now, the word "May" is a little harder. It can both mean "maybe" and also grant permission. "You may go home" could both mean "You might go home" or "You are allowed to go home". So, the sentence "You may get up to 5 days" that was in the November 4th, 2011 "Early Access Details" article would mean either "You might get as many as 5 days" or "You are allowed as many as five days". You'll notice both meanings do not indicate a firm 5 days, only an approximation. Hope that helped all you English as a second language folks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toggy Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 It is a play on words with advertisement. I can argue both sides here. If I gave you a glass water after you paid me $5.00 and I said you may drink this drink for up to 5 minutes what do you think I mean? That I may let you start at 1-5 minutes? Most would say that we have 5 minutes to drink it. "may" is not the same as "may be able to" But still, I expected something like 3 days since I pre-ordered in November. I saw the game they were playing with words and understood it. In actuality, I hold no grudge with them because I saw this coming. Still, I am just saying the people complaining have a case all be it a small one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzKrunch Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I can't be the highest level now so I'm cancelling Pre order and going to play Hello Kitty Fun Island Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoverFist Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) Judging by the forums it's apparently the most nebulous ,vague ,and befuddling composition of words since the dawn of the human language. Edited December 14, 2011 by HanoverFist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aethusa Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 not hard an ugly one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sivar Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Apparently it is..... ....sad........oh well moving on....in a month this will all be forgotten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gokkus Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Drama lamas will be drama lamas. Some are quite experienced in the art of overreacting and overdramatizing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onanonehand Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 The world is now a better place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shredding Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 English is my first and only fluent language, so I've never had problems with English terms such as "up to" or "may". Now, I'm assuming a lot of you must be ESL speakers (English as a second language) so I'm trying to figure out what terminology could be used to help you understand the English concept of "up to". In English, up to is a phrase used to indicate an indefinite number with a definite maximum. For example, if I were to pay you "up to 5 dollars" to mow my lawn, I could pay you any amount from 1 cent to 5 dollars. If I were to be at a party "up to" 10 oclock, I could leave that party at any point before 10 oclock and would still be accurate. Up to can also sometimes be used similar to "around" or "approximately". Now, the word "May" is a little harder. It can both mean "maybe" and also grant permission. "You may go home" could both mean "You might go home" or "You are allowed to go home". So, the sentence "You may get up to 5 days" that was in the November 4th, 2011 "Early Access Details" article would mean either "You might get as many as 5 days" or "You are allowed as many as five days". You'll notice both meanings do not indicate a firm 5 days, only an approximation. Hope that helped all you English as a second language folks People are upset cause there is OBVIOUS room on the servers. And dont feed the "people have work and school" stuff because check at 8 pm central and the servers will be heavy at worst. I think if the servers had more people on them it would be easier to swallow for everyone. Not to mention invites should go on past 12pm central. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorus Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 It is not a hard concept, but there is a very good reason that it is embraced by marketers and eschewed by public service people. This reaction was not only foreseeable but obvious. Scorus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xandes Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 What if they told you you could have up to 10 days of Early Access, but only let 10 people in on days 1-5. Sure, some people had up to 10 days, but the majority did not. They are still advertising up to 5 days of access if you pre order. Do you think, that if someone were to order today, they have any shot of getting 5 days of access? Absolutely not, and Bioware knows this. The system they put in place absolutely prohibits people from getting up to 5 days. If they hadn't extended EA for 2 days, the people who preordered in late July wouldn't have had a shot at getting up to 5 days, yet they continued to advertise that 5 days was a possibility, when it wasn't. "Up to" is a shady marketing ploy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustTed Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 It is a play on words with advertisement. I can argue both sides here. No you can't. You just can't read. "Up to five days early" is crystal clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustTed Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) What if they told you you could have up to 10 days of Early Access, but only let 10 people in on days 1-5. Sure, some people had up to 10 days, but the majority did not. Perfectly fair, providing everyone agreed in advance, like we did. They are still advertising up to 5 days of access if you pre order. Do you think, that if someone were to order today, they have any shot of getting 5 days of access? This is a separate issue, and yeah, they should take that down. But currently, no one has a right to complain. We're getting the product we ordered in the manner they said they'd give it to us. Anyone complaining wants something additional, like kids usually do. Edited December 14, 2011 by JustTed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexcyn Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Well the wording of this offer implies that anyone else who pre-ordered will be getting in tomorrow, since that will be the "up to 5 days" limit. If they don't I will rage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllenP Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 They are still advertising up to 5 days of access if you pre order. Do you think, that if someone were to order today, they have any shot of getting 5 days of access? This is a separate issue, and yeah, they should take that down.. Not really, the release date is the 20th, so IF (and that's a big if because no-one outside of BW knows) everyone who pre-orders now gets in tomorrow they still get their 5 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigaa Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Why do people not get this. In order for the term, "up to 5 days" to be true, there would of needed to be some chance at getting 5 days early access, even if it was only 1 in a million.But the fact is if you pre ordered after a certain date, you never had any chance of getting up to 5 days early access. The advertising was purposely miss leading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tectonics Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Well the wording of this offer implies that anyone else who pre-ordered will be getting in tomorrow, since that will be the "up to 5 days" limit. If they don't I will rage. no as the OP said the term "up to" is not a definate in itself, if you preordered tonight and redeemed the code, you would not be gaurenteed access tomorrow, as that is not what is being advertised. Its a shady marketing ploy, but its one thats used because it gives the producer in this case Bioware alot of room to maneuver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosev Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 It is a play on words with advertisement. I can argue both sides here. In actuality, I hold no grudge with them because I saw this coming. Still, I am just saying the people complaining have a case all be it a small one. By all means argue for the other side, I am more than interested to try and un-comprehend those words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted December 14, 2011 Author Share Posted December 14, 2011 Why do people not get this. In order for the term, "up to 5 days" to be true, there would of needed to be some chance at getting 5 days early access, even if it was only 1 in a million. But the fact is if you pre ordered after a certain date, you never had any chance of getting up to 5 days early access. The advertising was purposely miss leading. There was a chance, when the game first released for preordering. Your chance decreased every day from that point forward. Since they could not predict preorder numbers, they can't sit there and adjust the "Up to" to 4, then 3, then 2 then 1 as they go, as they can't see the future. You see, we humans are what is sometimes called "3 dimensional beings". We are incapable of perceiving the 4th dimension, time, in anything but slices. Second by second. Due to our limitations as 3rd dimensional beings we cannot "See the future". I know, tough concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigaa Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 There was a chance, when the game first released for preordering. Your chance decreased every day from that point forward. Since they could not predict preorder numbers, they can't sit there and adjust the "Up to" to 4, then 3, then 2 then 1 as they go, as they can't see the future. You see, we humans are what is sometimes called "3 dimensional beings". We are incapable of perceiving the 4th dimension, time, in anything but slices. Second by second. Due to our limitations as 3rd dimensional beings we cannot "See the future". I know, tough concept. well they have not changed the advertisement yet. STOP BEING BROWN NOSING FaNBOYS! Your so willing to take it up the ***. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosev Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 no as the OP said the term "up to" is not a definate in itself, if you preordered tonight and redeemed the code, you would not be gaurenteed access tomorrow, as that is not what is being advertised. Its a shady marketing ploy, but its one thats used because it gives the producer in this case Bioware alot of room to maneuver Soooo, you guys maintain that it's shady not to guarantee a number to everyone? Yes it does leave room to maneuver. Suddenly that's a bad thing? I am truly trying to understand your logic. Unfortunately the thing you are completely lacking is... logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TepiNyan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 English is my first and only fluent language, so I've never had problems with English terms such as "up to" or "may". Now, I'm assuming a lot of you must be ESL speakers (English as a second language) so I'm trying to figure out what terminology could be used to help you understand the English concept of "up to". In English, up to is a phrase used to indicate an indefinite number with a definite maximum. For example, if I were to pay you "up to 5 dollars" to mow my lawn, I could pay you any amount from 1 cent to 5 dollars. If I were to be at a party "up to" 10 oclock, I could leave that party at any point before 10 oclock and would still be accurate. Up to can also sometimes be used similar to "around" or "approximately". Now, the word "May" is a little harder. It can both mean "maybe" and also grant permission. "You may go home" could both mean "You might go home" or "You are allowed to go home". So, the sentence "You may get up to 5 days" that was in the November 4th, 2011 "Early Access Details" article would mean either "You might get as many as 5 days" or "You are allowed as many as five days". You'll notice both meanings do not indicate a firm 5 days, only an approximation. Hope that helped all you English as a second language folks it is indeed, as you said, an approximation. now quit while you're ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xandes Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 There was a chance, when the game first released for preordering. Your chance decreased every day from that point forward. Since they could not predict preorder numbers, they can't sit there and adjust the "Up to" to 4, then 3, then 2 then 1 as they go, as they can't see the future. You see, we humans are what is sometimes called "3 dimensional beings". We are incapable of perceiving the 4th dimension, time, in anything but slices. Second by second. Due to our limitations as 3rd dimensional beings we cannot "See the future". I know, tough concept. Are you implying they had no idea what their own preorder numbers were? The fact is that they are STILL saying you have a possibility of getting 5 days if you preorder today. They know for a fact that you will not get 5 days if you preorder today. And again, if they hadn't extended it by two days, people who preordered in the first month wouldn't have had a shot at getting 5 days, and they knew that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustTed Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Soooo, you guys maintain that it's shady not to guarantee a number to everyone? Here's what YOU agreed to. You pre-order, then get in between the 15th and 19th. This is exactly what you're getting. Where are you getting lost? Why do you insist upon adding new conditions to an agreement made in the past? This issue is entirely your fault. Bioware is right, you are wrong, and that's that. You can say "fanboi" now instead of addressing any of the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted December 14, 2011 Author Share Posted December 14, 2011 well they have not changed the advertisement yet. STOP BEING BROWN NOSING FaNBOYS! Your so willing to take it up the ***. Because the advertisement could still be true. it's the 14th, official release is the 20th, meaning getting in tomorrow would still be "up to 5 days". You see, a day is what we call a full rotation of the earth on its axis. This takes around 24 hours and happens, amazingly, like clockwork. So between the 15th and 20th, the earth will rotate 5 times, meaning 5 days will have past, meaning that "up to five days" is still completely accurate as of today. Something you may not know is that the sun doesn't actually "rise", but instead the earth turns into the sun making it appear to rise. Neat, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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