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FPS/LAG Issues in Pvp - Gone for Me


ZeroNeutral

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Previously I was running on a 2.6ghz dual-core 45nm proc, DDR2 800 RAM, and a Radeon HD 6850 video card. They were all in a stock Dell motherboard.

 

With that setup I would get horrible delay between skill use in PvP, terrible FPS on Vaiken, and overall a crummy experience like a lot of people are complaining about.

 

Then I upgraded to a FX4100 3.6ghz quad-core 32nm proc, DDR3 1600 RAM, same video card. They are all on an Asus micro-ATX mobo...

 

Now I have zero problems with this game in any way. I am boasting max settings, with additional forced settings. Pvp in Alderaan is smooth and

 

So, I really think that perhaps people need to take a look at their processor speed. Not the cores, the speed. I purposely bought the faster core speed with 2 less cores than a more expensive proc model.

 

SWTOR benefits hugely from a good processor/RAM.

 

I would say that from now on, people need to honestly add their system specs to their complaints... This is one of the reasons why it's so hard to develop for the PC - everyone has different hardware setups.

 

For me, those problems that everyone is complaining about, and that I also experienced... it WAS my hardware.

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A lot of the people complaining are those with absolute beast systems that run 100+ FPS outside warzones but chug at 10-15 FPS inside them.

 

Yes, upgrading hardware may be an issue, but that's not the complaint most are having.

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That might be true, but then it's obviously some variant of their hardware causing the problem.

 

It could be common amongst many people or not, but no one is going about this in a manner that benefits anyone who might be trying to fix the problem, or find it.

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If its true that THE ONLY way to fix the lag/delay issue is just buying some superb machine, many people will quit it very fast.

 

My comp is much above suggested system req. I can play this game on high, still I'm okay playing it on low, I just care about maximum possible performance. That's why I play with everything turned off. Sad part is the game runs pretty much the same with settings on high and when on low. I just wanna play the game that is able to run smoothly.

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Performance in Warzones/Ilum is horrible. It's unplayable most cases. Only thing that works "decent" is voidstar.

 

It's ruined pvp for me completely and I only do it to finish daylies now, there's no reason to pain myself through it any more.

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That might be true, but then it's obviously some variant of their hardware causing the problem.

 

It could be common amongst many people or not, but no one is going about this in a manner that benefits anyone who might be trying to fix the problem, or find it.

 

It's a common issue, people have tried to find a fix, bioware are just ignoring it.

 

If I can run skyrim on ultra at 60fps (more indoors) I should NOT run aldaraan on low at 7fps. Not that low, high, or anywhere in between actually changes anything.

Edited by Norr
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It's a common issue, people have tried to find a fix, bioware are just ignoring it.

 

If I can run skyrim on ultra at 60fps (more indoors) I should NOT run aldaraan on low at 7fps. Not that low, high, or anywhere in between actually changes anything.

 

Unless there is a problem with your setup and SWTOR specifically... which seems to be the case. How will they know without proper system info?

 

People are posting a complaint with no info...

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That's the point. There's something wrong with game. You can spend lots of cash getting new machine, but not everyone would do that. If such comp was required to run this game in a good way, they should have said before. Now they just need to come up with some sollution and nothing else.
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If its true that THE ONLY way to fix the lag/delay issue is just buying some superb machine, many people will quit it very fast.

 

My comp is much above suggested system req. I can play this game on high, still I'm okay playing it on low, I just care about maximum possible performance. That's why I play with everything turned off. Sad part is the game runs pretty much the same with settings on high and when on low. I just wanna play the game that is able to run smoothly.

 

This is not a superb setup... those upgrades cost about $250

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I don't know if this is the only issue causing bad frames, but personally in my case this is how I fixed it as well. Went from an Athlon Dual core at 3.0ghz to a Phenom II x4 BE at 3.5ghz. I no longer get the issues in WZ that I used to get. Probably not the solution for everyone but for some it might be the fix.
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After a lot of thought and testing about the whole ability delay and FPS issues that people are seeing in WZs and Ops, I'd like to post something that I believe to be the culprit as far as the game engine is concerned. My hopes are just that the developers can see this and take the data I've collected and analyzed.

 

Just as a precursor to this post. I have a q6600 @ 2.4 GHz, HD 6970, and 6 Gbs of DDR. I get a solid 40-60 fps out on missions. However, my frame rate drops to as low as 10-15 in WZs, and about 20-25 in even 8 man Ops.

 

Something that I've noticed quite often is that I don't have any FPS degradation or ability lag while questing or in 4 man flashpoints. There doesn't appear to be any ability lag, and I don't have any problem chain casting heals, or chaining on instant cast abilities in between casted time spells. These are both things that I am almost unable to do in WZs and Ops. Chain casting incurs a large delay between even two casted spells, and an even larger delay between a casted spell and an instant spell. This creates the stigma of "lag" in the networking sense. I don't think this to be the case. I don't think that there is any real problem with the networking being done by the server/clients involved and below is why.

 

I never see any of this in World of Warcraft. And I've never seen it through my PC upgrading process. I think the primary reason people are experiencing ability lag is a combination of FPS drops when large numbers of people are in one area, and the long, elaborate, animations that SWTOR uses in the game.

 

If you think of the casting animation in World of Warcraft they have a casting state that is pretty unimpressive and then an actual casting animation at the tail end of the channel, or instant spell, or at the end of a casted spell that lasts for about .25 seconds. So the alloted time for animation on the client side only requires .25 seconds OUT OF THE 1.5 SECOND GLOBAL COOL DOWN. A decrease in FPS in this scenario will only impact the .25 base "activation" animation taking a .25 second animation maybe .4 or .5 seconds to finish, much much shorter than the 1.5 second global cooldown and thus does not create a large ability delay, allowing chain casting, and the weaving of instant spells. You can begin casting your next spell after the .25 second animation, outside of the GCD.

 

In SWTOR, the long animations often take the ENTIRE 1.5 SECONDS OF THE GLOBAL COOL DOWN. And you are unable to begin casting another spell, be it instant or casted or channeled until the preceding animation finishes. Thusly, if you incur an FPS degradation in SWTOR of even a 20-30 FPS drop from the standard 60 FPS that is usually believed to be ideal conditions, you are effectively increasing the GCD as a whole, because animations take the entirety of the GCD instead of the .25 second animations that World of Warcraft uses. The 1.5 second spell animation takes 2.0 to even 2.5 seconds to finish and alludes to a 2.0 to 2.5 second "perceived" GCD, thus creating the illusion of ability lag.

 

I don't believe the problem to be in anyway connected to networking servicing, but a combination of very long casting animations, and FPS drops being experience by the vast majorty of players when many players are being rendered in the engine. I think most people that I've encountered during my testing weren't necessarily getting obscene FPS drops during WZs and Ops to the extent that others have been reporting (5-10 FPS in WZs), but the FPS degradation that they WERE experiencing was resulting in the large ability delays described above that puts a real damper on the enjoyment of PvP and PvE from pretty much every angle.

 

There are obviously two solutions to this problem, and solving both would give the developers the most flexibility when it comes to varying hardware performance:

 

Ability animations should not take the entirety of the GCD in order to complete. Even a slight drop in FPS is going to create this "perceived" ability lag to a degree. If this is the intent, then I propose that you allow the engine to interrupt the animations of a prior cast, with that of a new cast outside of the GCD, whether the animation finishes or not. This may look a little funny, but would also alleviate the ability lag.

 

Fix the engine's ability to render multiple players, in an attempt to levy that FPS drop culprit behind this phenomenon. If you don't wish to change the animations, there can't be any graphical delays that inhibit players from using abilities until the animation is over.

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I don't know if this is the only issue causing bad frames, but personally in my case this is how I fixed it as well. Went from an Athlon Dual core at 3.0ghz to a Phenom II x4 BE at 3.5ghz. I no longer get the issues in WZ that I used to get. Probably not the solution for everyone but for some it might be the fix.

 

Thanks for posting, now I feel less crazy :o

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After a lot of thought and testing about the whole ability delay and FPS issues that people are seeing in WZs and Ops, I'd like to post something that I believe to be the culprit as far as the game engine is concerned. My hopes are just that the developers can see this and take the data I've collected and analyzed.

 

Just as a precursor to this post. I have a q6600 @ 2.4 GHz, HD 6970, and 6 Gbs of DDR. I get a solid 40-60 fps out on missions. However, my frame rate drops to as low as 10-15 in WZs, and about 20-25 in even 8 man Ops.

 

Something that I've noticed quite often is that I don't have any FPS degradation or ability lag while questing or in 4 man flashpoints. There doesn't appear to be any ability lag, and I don't have any problem chain casting heals, or chaining on instant cast abilities in between casted time spells. These are both things that I am almost unable to do in WZs and Ops. Chain casting incurs a large delay between even two casted spells, and an even larger delay between a casted spell and an instant spell. This creates the stigma of "lag" in the networking sense. I don't think this to be the case. I don't think that there is any real problem with the networking being done by the server/clients involved and below is why.

 

I never see any of this in World of Warcraft. And I've never seen it through my PC upgrading process. I think the primary reason people are experiencing ability lag is a combination of FPS drops when large numbers of people are in one area, and the long, elaborate, animations that SWTOR uses in the game.

 

If you think of the casting animation in World of Warcraft they have a casting state that is pretty unimpressive and then an actual casting animation at the tail end of the channel, or instant spell, or at the end of a casted spell that lasts for about .25 seconds. So the alloted time for animation on the client side only requires .25 seconds OUT OF THE 1.5 SECOND GLOBAL COOL DOWN. A decrease in FPS in this scenario will only impact the .25 base "activation" animation taking a .25 second animation maybe .4 or .5 seconds to finish, much much shorter than the 1.5 second global cooldown and thus does not create a large ability delay, allowing chain casting, and the weaving of instant spells. You can begin casting your next spell after the .25 second animation, outside of the GCD.

 

In SWTOR, the long animations often take the ENTIRE 1.5 SECONDS OF THE GLOBAL COOL DOWN. And you are unable to begin casting another spell, be it instant or casted or channeled until the preceding animation finishes. Thusly, if you incur an FPS degradation in SWTOR of even a 20-30 FPS drop from the standard 60 FPS that is usually believed to be ideal conditions, you are effectively increasing the GCD as a whole, because animations take the entirety of the GCD instead of the .25 second animations that World of Warcraft uses. The 1.5 second spell animation takes 2.0 to even 2.5 seconds to finish and alludes to a 2.0 to 2.5 second "perceived" GCD, thus creating the illusion of ability lag.

 

I don't believe the problem to be in anyway connected to networking servicing, but a combination of very long casting animations, and FPS drops being experience by the vast majorty of players when many players are being rendered in the engine. I think most people that I've encountered during my testing weren't necessarily getting obscene FPS drops during WZs and Ops to the extent that others have been reporting (5-10 FPS in WZs), but the FPS degradation that they WERE experiencing was resulting in the large ability delays described above that puts a real damper on the enjoyment of PvP and PvE from pretty much every angle.

 

There are obviously two solutions to this problem, and solving both would give the developers the most flexibility when it comes to varying hardware performance:

 

Ability animations should not take the entirety of the GCD in order to complete. Even a slight drop in FPS is going to create this "perceived" ability lag to a degree. If this is the intent, then I propose that you allow the engine to interrupt the animations of a prior cast, with that of a new cast outside of the GCD, whether the animation finishes or not. This may look a little funny, but would also alleviate the ability lag.

 

Fix the engine's ability to render multiple players, in an attempt to levy that FPS drop culprit behind this phenomenon. If you don't wish to change the animations, there can't be any graphical delays that inhibit players from using abilities until the animation is over.

 

This is a great example of my point.

 

MMOs heavily favor processing power when many players are involved. You have a 2.4ghz proc... that's not even CLOSE to enough... you need at LEAST 3.0ghz dual-core to play the game but in PvP you will want closer to 4.0ghz. Right off the bat I can see your problem.

 

In Warzones your processor is getting SLAMMED with work. FAR more than PvE. You need a new proccy... The engine is not designed to play well in PvP with that many players on YOUR processor... you can't handle it.

 

You don't see these issues in WoW because WoW was designed to run on very very low end systems. In Vanilla WoW, people had it running on a Pentium II with 256mb of RAM... for comparison. We're not in WoW any more.

 

You cannot compare the performance you have in one game to another since they are completely different. This is another common form of complaint that I see...

 

You didn't need to type a long post, you only needed to type 2.4ghz dual-core... it's not nearly sufficient.

 

Your processor is 45nm or higher which is far less efficient than the modern 32nm processors... also this means your mobo FSB is slower than current tech... sorry it's upgrade time.

 

I also forgot to mention that your memory speed on the motherboard which could support that chip is probably very slow compared to modern tech.

Edited by ZeroNeutral
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What about those of us who don't suffer from any FPS issues but the lag and ability delay in warzones is horrible? Never had framerate issues but skills are far from instant and people warp around in the craziest ways.

 

What is your system setup pls?

 

Also check http://www.speedtest.net to determine your connection speed.

Edited by ZeroNeutral
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  • 3 months later...
I have a Raedon 4800 HD Series G-card and for my processor i have a AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 6000+, and I'm having the same problems with FPS lag in PvP and in large groups. My computer exceeds the minimum specs for the game. Any solutions?
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