Very anoying, and shared by most MMO's

[Cwyn]

problem?, this guy can understand it to.

 

It didn't help that you used the word "hostage" where you meant "hostile". I was wondering what evil Sith was taking fish hostage. And yes, your argument is largely valid across a wide swath of MMO games out there.

 

But have you noticed, on the Republic side, there are quite a bit of fauna that aren't aggressive? On the Empire planets, it seems like everything is hostile. I chalk that up to the Jedi promoting harmony whereas the Sith sow discord wherever they go. So, those Sith planets have a whole lot of angry critters running about. But even on the neutral planets, Empire players can run into civilian types who aren't aggressive.

[Valkyriane]

EvE online.

[pakchooieunf]

It's a valid, if extremely poorly worded, question.

 

Agreed.

 

The most concise answer I can give is this: lazy design. You can interchange the word "lazy" with "convenient" if you like.

 

 

In a nutshell (and without delving back to D&D), MMOs were preceded by multi-user dungeon crawls. These games grew and began to offer the potential of a entire virtual worlds. We can call these ambitious games "sandbox worlds".

 

You can imagine, however, the complexities of trying to create a virtual world sandbox. Just ask a SWG developer.

 

As a result, MMO development has regressed to it's primitive form of dungeon crawling. Don't be fooled by outdoor worlds, NPC cities, or spaceships. Every map in this game is, at it's core, a dungeon crawl. It's a gauntlet populated by aggressive monsters, littered with some treasures, and the point of the entire game is to raid an area, murder the inhabitants, loot their trousers, put said trousers on yourself so that you can raid dungeons that require more durable trousers.

Edited January 10, 2012 by pakchooieunf

[Game_Hermit]

It's a valid, if extremely poorly worded, question.

 

Not valid, at least not in TOR. I have never been to a planet yet where there wasn't some stuff that wouldn't attack you. The uxibeasts and flying mobs on tython are a good example. The uxibeasts have green names so you can't fight them even if you want to. The flying ones will only attack if you attack them first.

[Holt]

Sorta reminds me of a certain Sword in box make light sword.

[Cwyn]

Not valid, at least not in TOR. I have never been to a planet yet where there wasn't some stuff that wouldn't attack you. The uxibeasts and flying mobs on tython are a good example. The uxibeasts have green names so you can't fight them even if you want to. The flying ones will only attack if you attack them first.

 

Go to Korriban or Dromund Kaas.

[pakchooieunf]

Not valid, at least not in TOR. I have never been to a planet yet where there wasn't some stuff that wouldn't attack you. The uxibeasts and flying mobs on tython are a good example. The uxibeasts have green names so you can't fight them even if you want to. The flying ones will only attack if you attack them first.

 

It's valid if you make the very sensible recognition that the OP was deliberately exaggerating the situation to emphasize his/her point. The vast majority of gameplay involves running a gauntlet of murderous monsters, robots, and psychopathic humanoids, lightly dusted with non-aggressive critters that only seem to be there for the sake of tradition.

[pjskull]

Why in all game from Lotro to Aion do sword in box all seem so hostage that why are not to come in and see all MMO to have and share main problem and even the fish are to some and not to others that may be Pirate or Thul but see me and attack but not to Tiger but not lion or bear?

 

Answer that and see if one can but not the other to like and hostage all sword in box...?

[alexlongwell]

Thanks, Pak.

 

What's even bothered me more in MMOs...take WoW for example.

 

You have pirates which are hostile.

 

You have tigers which are hostile.

 

Both attack the player; that makes sense.

 

NEITHER ATTACKS EACH OTHER.

 

Okay, so wait; when it comes to tigers, the pirates are relaxed and at peace?

When it comes to pirates, the tigers aren't hungry?

 

From forays into programming/level design, I know why this is. They have a faction for "hostile" and all hostile mobs belong to it. The script for "hostile" mobs is simple:

 

Attacks the player.

 

It would require much more attention to detail to create a host of factions who treated the player the same (attack) but each other differently. (Pirates attack pirates but perhaps not the goblins nearby.)

 

The one concession WoW made to this was occasionally a wild animal will pounce (and kill) a critter (nonviolent mob)...example, a wolf would kill a rabbit.

 

 

At least in Skyrim that pesky troll could tank that dragon while i snipe it with arrows...

[Bekkal]

EQ had a ton of non-aggro mobs. Turns out having several thousand factions to keep track of doesn't add much when you're killing everything anyway.

[HanzoV]

Mobs WHY U NO liek me? Edited January 10, 2012 by HanzoV

[ShadowFated]

oke, sinds the last 10 years i have been playing MMO's

first i did not play much attention to it, after a while you might even consider it normal.

but what is this crap, from past few year's that any mob you encounter is hostage, from robot to human, to creature hell even the fish try to tear you apart if you are unlucky.

 

this is not only in SW, but same rule go's in Rift, Aion, put your MMO here, it is the same.

do this supoce to enlighting my game experience? or something?

or is their a law against gamers to be kill on sight?

 

nom nom nom grammar tastes so good!

[KennethHoover]

Pick up Strunk and White's The Elements of Style. Study it thoroughly. Then come back and repost your thoughts.

[Cwyn]

Why in all game from Lotro to Aion do sword in box all seem so hostage that why are not to come in and see all MMO to have and share main problem and even the fish are to some and not to others that may be Pirate or Thul but see me and attack but not to Tiger but not lion or bear?

 

Answer that and see if one can but not the other to like and hostage all sword in box...?

 

Wow! You have made me dumber. Just wow!

[pjskull]

Wow! You have made me dumber. Just wow!

 

You are quite welcome dear sir!

 

Enjoy your day.

[Slightlycampana]

I find this annoying too. You can't run anywhere in the game world without being attacked by evenly spaced mobs at regular intervals.

 

Really irritating, artificial and immersion-breaking.

 

I would much prefer a system where NPCs are grouped up in herds or packs that you can navigate between. Taking questlines should throw you into the middle of them, or give you a reason to negotiate them, rather than travelling simply from point A to point B.

[Aisar]

oke, sinds the last 10 years i have been playing MMO's

first i did not play much attention to it, after a while you might even consider it normal.

but what is this crap, from past few year's that any mob you encounter is hostage, from robot to human, to creature hell even the fish try to tear you apart if you are unlucky.

 

this is not only in SW, but same rule go's in Rift, Aion, put your MMO here, it is the same.

do this supoce to enlighting my game experience? or something?

or is their a law against gamers to be kill on sight?

 

Uhh yes most monsters in this game will try to stabby stab stab you, very hard and very quickly. Most stuff is aggresive to you..

 

That is usually why safe areas like major cities or even quest hubs do not usually have hostile monsters/people around. Some forbid fighting of any kind. It would be boring if nothing wantedto kill me ^^

[HanzoV]

Anyone find that the mobs aggro range is pretty short, though? I feel like I can sneak between two sets of aggressive mobs, pretty closely, where in other games at that range, they would both be gnawing at my backside.

[Tenetke]

Translation:

 

Dear reader,

 

As a 10-year veteran MMO player, I have noticed a frustrating commonality among many of these games. It seems that every creature and NPC you encounter in the wild is hostile, and will attack you on-sight without the slightest provocation. Robots, humans, even fish in the sea all have the same opportunistic predatory instincts.

 

This is a common thread shared by many MMO games - SWTOR, Rift, Aion, etc., - everywhere I go, I find the same behavior. Is there some sort of conspiracy against player-characters that requires all NPCs to adopt a kill-on-sight doctrine?

 

This post actually made sense, and honestly I've found myself curious about this also. I can see certain enemies(empire, thugs etc) but random guys that shouldn't have any reason to hate me suddenly want to kill me for some unknown reason.

 

I remember before I turned on showing enemy name plates I saw a bunch of guys standing around in the desert. I thought, hmm what's this. Ohhh did I learn quickly that for some reason those guys will simply slaughter you on sight. I think it was the guys around the sarl pit on tat. Then I saw a mandalorian sitting by himself. Got close and he opens up. Why exactly? This was on my smuggler, so it's not like I was wearing a republic uniform or anything.

 

Now when I went on my jedi I fully expected it.

 

Some of the wildlife have a similar habit of randomly attacking me. Now that makes sense on say my smuggler, but shouldn't my Jedi be able to commune with the beast? Maybe calm it or something.

 

I'm not really complaining because I understand that's just how a mmo is.

 

I suppose they could have created a few different hidden factions and made them have different aggressive flags.

 

faction animal_neutral_lightside: neutral to jedi knight, consular, aggressive everyone else

faction animal_neutral_darkside: neutral sw si, aggressive everyone else

faction separatist: neutral bh,smuggler, aggressive everyone else

etc

 

It would still allow you to attack and kill them, but they would behave differently depending on your class. Would make the world seem very different depending on class, but I also know that's lots more work.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Tenetke

[Zeldias]

I wish there was at least a hostile creature faction and a hostile human/droid faction. Damaged/out of control droids could go into hostile creatures. Then humans/droids with their faculties would fight creatures flagged as part of the creature faction or something.

 

I've always found this silly in MMOs, too.

 

BTW, OP, I understood you until I hit hostage. Then I didn't know what the heck you meant.

[abishe]

Uhh yes most monsters in this game will try to stabby stab stab you, very hard and very quickly. Most stuff is aggresive to you..

 

That is usually why safe areas like major cities or even quest hubs do not usually have hostile monsters/people around. Some forbid fighting of any kind. It would be boring if nothing wantedto kill me ^^

 

you know how unrealistic, this looks?.

even a wild beast, like a tiger/lion just attack you on sight, only when hungry.

this point, also brings me to psychology, you player hot shot. slayer of titans, comes to a compound, of nothing's, yet those guy's do like you are a nothing. or just dirt

 

in real life, we got something like reputation, if you are so dangers, deathly or so well know.

NPC reactions sudden be like this for instance.

 

 

true how people supoce to react when faceing legends, crime lords.

that even criminals, fears you.

 

just a little thought on matter.

[Blackavaar]

oke, sinds the last 10 years i have been playing MMO's

first i did not play much attention to it, after a while you might even consider it normal.

but what is this crap, from past few year's that any mob you encounter is hostage, from robot to human, to creature hell even the fish try to tear you apart if you are unlucky.

 

this is not only in SW, but same rule go's in Rift, Aion, put your MMO here, it is the same.

do this supoce to enlighting my game experience? or something?

or is their a law against gamers to be kill on sight?

 

Translation:

 

Dear reader,

 

As a 10-year veteran MMO player, I have noticed a frustrating commonality among many of these games. It seems that every creature and NPC you encounter in the wild is hostile, and will attack you on-sight without the slightest provocation. Robots, humans, even fish in the sea all have the same opportunistic predatory instincts.

 

This is a common thread shared by many MMO games - SWTOR, Rift, Aion, etc., - everywhere I go, I find the same behavior. Is there some sort of conspiracy against player-characters that requires all NPCs to adopt a kill-on-sight doctrine?

Ah, I understand now. Thanks for translating for us , Pak.

 

In case you didn't notice there are a number of green and yellow tagged creatures in the wild (found on Tython, Alderaan, Balmorra for example). There are also a number of green tagged NPCs that are just civilians standing around in different areas (on Nar Shadaa for instance) of SWTOR. Not everything here wants to kill you, though most maybe do. The reason being that wild animals are wild animals and work on predatory instinct to survive. If an animal is a carnivore it only makes sense that it would attack someone who crossed its path. And gangland thugs and rebels and such are gangland thugs and rebels and such and will do the same thing to protect what they perceive to be their territory. Don't you think?

 

Edit: In other words, if you pay attention to the story lines of the game and the lore of the creatures it makes sense.

 

Edited January 10, 2012 by Blackavaar

[Nizzemancer]

Mobs WHY U NO liek me?

 

Forever Aggroed

[pakchooieunf]

Ah, I understand now. Thanks for translating for us , Pak.

 

In case you didn't notice there are a number of green and yellow tagged creatures in the wild (found on Tython, Alderaan, Balmorra for example). There are also a number of green tagged NPCs that are just civilians standing around in different areas (on Nar Shadaa for instance) of SWTOR. Not everything here wants to kill you, though most maybe do. The reason being that wild animals are wild animals and work on predatory instinct to survive. If an animal is a carnivore it only makes sense that it would attack someone who crossed its path. And gangland thugs and rebels and such are gangland thugs and rebels and such and will do the same thing to protect what they perceive to be their territory. Don't you think?

 

 

Yes and no. If we take the "well, these animals are predators", then we're trying to invoke some kind of real-world analogy. This is quickly broken by the fact that there is nothing resembling a food chain. Each planet apparently has only 1-3 animal species, most of which are ruthlessly aggressive predators. This doesn't resemble any kind of animal kingdom that we are familiar with. It is further broken by the fact that even real predatory animals are not hell-bent on slaughtering everything that approaches within a 10 meter radius.

 

Even gangs, at some level, have to discriminate between violence that will be worthwhile, and casual violence that will bring more trouble than it's worth. Never mind the fact that if I'm traveling through the wilderness and I have to shoot a bear to defend myself, I won't have to shoot and kill the same bear later on when I'm heading back. Basically, we can't introduce real-world analogies here.

 

What's really going on is that (and I'm going to copy-paste my response here since I don't feel like re-typing it..) MMO development has regressed to it's primitive form of dungeon crawling. Don't be fooled by outdoor worlds, NPC cities, or spaceships. Every map in this game is, at it's core, a dungeon crawl. It's a gauntlet populated by aggressive monsters, littered with some treasures, and the point of the entire game is to raid an area, murder the inhabitants, loot their trousers, put said trousers on yourself so that you can raid dungeons that require more durable trousers.

 

That's it. End of story. There's no immersion-driven explanation for this. I barely have to use my imagination to come up with a system that would create a more dynamic population of critters and NPCs, but the reality is that this game (and others like it) is designed to force players to navigate and confront hordes of angry monsters. That's what this game is about. There was never any intention of giving players a living, breathing Star Wars experience. It's a Star Wars dungeon crawl, just like WoW is a Warcraft dungeon crawl.

Edited January 10, 2012 by pakchooieunf

[Quip]

It's true MMO worlds are composed of players and things that want to kill players. The trouble is that friendly NPCs and Animals eat up server resources, that's the problem.