Dirty Fighting Scoundrel Useless

[Auxili]

Is Bioware ever going to make this shared tree useful for Scoundrels?

 

Currently the gunslinger variant works fine and is equal to sab and sharpshooter in its own unique way. But Dirty Fighting (lethality of snipers) is most definitely much worse than Scoundrel's own dps tree.

 

When you roll scoundrel, you're forced to choose from one healing tree or one dps tree. You don't get 2 dps trees, since dirty fighting is useless in this AC.

 

 

Bioware, you intentionally made it so this is how the dirty fighting spec plays out for Scoundrels.

You are directly responsible for the tree's weaknesses, since you:

1) reduced the range on shots from 15m to 10m

and 2) added the upper hand requirement for Wounding Shots.

 

Not to mention one of the perks in the tree doesn't even work, which gives us the impression that:

1) you aren't paying much attention to this tree

2) you don't test the tree

and 3) you don't take it very seriously

 

Both of these result in a tree that looks hopeless as you've intentionally made it a bad tree during the past couple of months, and haven't fixed the bugs within.

 

Keep in mind the perk that doesn't work for smugglers works for agents, which doesn't help the "developers play empire" stigma very much. I don't subscribe to that thought, I just thought I'd let you know what people around me in-game seem to feel about the class.

 

 

Thanks for having an open ear and open mind, and thanks for allowing me to give my feedback.

[mrfoughtforever]

Dirty Fighting is an excellent PvP spec for Scoundrels if played correctly. I've been topping the charts since I made the switch. People grossly underestimate the effects of bleeds in PvP. I've killed many people by simply dotting them up and running away to heal myself. Also, scoundrels are a melee class, so the short range isn't an issue.

 

As far as bugged talents go, they're aware at least, but understand this isn't a bug report or suggestions forum. File an in-game ticket with your concerns.

[KoenigNord]

I used to play Dirty Fighting until lvl 30. Couldn't compete with a friend in PvE but PvP was great with all the dots. Since i am focussing PvE and open world PvP right now I switched to the scrapper-tree.

It's way better against single enemies but Dirty Fighting was amazing against large number of enemies like in WZ.

[Mourn]

For the 2 guys who have played the DF tree.

 

Any tips/tactics you want to share with people?

[KoenigNord]

Dot everyone and throw grenades everywhere the enemies are crowding, not so difficult

 

Vital Shot and Shrap Bomb are pretty good, don't forget the Skills regarding periodic damage.

I guess the other bleeding Skills you can get in the higher level are nice, too.

 

I propose that these skills might work very good:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#701bfZhZGbrkMrhdGo.1

You will regain a lot of energy per crit of bleeding by this and cool head is very good. You need all the energy to dot everyone

Edited January 10, 2012 by KoenigNord

[Mourn]

Dot everyone and throw grenades everywhere the enemies are crowding, not so difficult

 

Vital Shot and Shrap Bomb are pretty good, don't forget the Skills regarding periodic damage.

I guess the other bleeding Skills you can get in the higher level are nice, too.

 

I propose that these skills might work very good:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#701bfZhZGbrkMrhdGo.1

You will regain a lot of energy per crit of bleeding by this and cool head is very good. You need all the energy to dot everyone

 

 

Thanks for the tips!

 

How is this build 1-1 ?

Why the 2 points in alacirity we dont really need it do we?

[Rezoh]

Thanks for the tips!

 

How is this build 1-1 ?

Why the 2 points in alacirity we dont really need it do we?

 

We don't need alacrity. Period.

 

I tried the dirty fighting tree with this build

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#701bfZhZhrbkrrGdho.1

 

You can also swap the 2 points of Keep Cool for Exploratory Surgery, because in PvP You ll be lacking those Upper Hands Badly.

[Auxili]

Isn't mobility a problem, with that 10m range (which is a step away from melee range) and no gap-closers?

[KoenigNord]

you are right, I will fix this when I will respec to dirty fighting, thx.

 

mobility wasn't a problem so far. Imagine yourself as a luring poinsining killer. anyone who walks into range will be very very sick.

 

Still i don't know a Gunslinger-Build, so can't compare it.

[Loklamone]

the 10m range is ok because u still do decent damage at a range. when im hitting people at range i just go into cover for the defensive bonus and can use charged shot and det pack as well as stack my dots then when some jedi descides to come in on me hes sorry use wounding shot, dirty kick, pistol whip and back blast does huge burst usually gets them to the 40 percent mark for you to throw on your hemmorage to finnish him off. i like this tree because i feel like im effective at all ranges. when i play scrapper i feel gimped when some butt head starts kiting me.

 

edit:

i almost forgot u may not have a gap closer but between sharp bomb (slow), tendon blast (slow) and dirty kick (stun, speed boost) who the hell is gonna get away from u and what kind of sith warrior is gonna chase u effectively

Edited January 11, 2012 by Loklamone

[Loklamone]

dots keep people from planting bombs and capturing points so it is absolutly amazing in alderan and void star. i have a sage healer friend he and i kept 4 people from capturing an alderan turret for 4-5 mins running around and sharp, thermal bomb spamming we were both laughing our heads off at their frustraition because they couldnt chase us because of my aoe sharp bomb slow

[KoenigNord]

so, the advantage of the scoundrel are definitely his other 2 trees. You get a lot of bleeding boosts for vital shot. Less costs, more dmg. I would favor this over the 5m advantage.

[Auxili]

so, the advantage of the scoundrel are definitely his other 2 trees. You get a lot of bleeding boosts for vital shot. Less costs, more dmg. I would favor this over the 5m advantage.

 

25m, you mean.

scoundrel dirty fighters get a 10m range.

gunslinger dirty fighters get a 30-35m range. And their wounding shot does much more damage

[Loklamone]

it may do more damage but theirs has a cool down ours uses upper hand so its up more often

[Auxili]

it may do more damage but theirs has a cool down ours uses upper hand so its up more often

 

It requiring upper hand means its up less often. other upper-hand attacks do just as much damage too so may as well use those, you dont really benefit from using wounding shot

[Loklamone]

It requiring upper hand means its up less often. other upper-hand attacks do just as much damage too so may as well use those, you dont really benefit from using wounding shot

 

guess i pistol whip and have the underworld talent and i off heal myself so i tend to have it up quite a bit im not saying that gunslingers verson isnt better but since i can spam it twice or 3 times if i stack it b4 fight then pistol whip

[Auxili]

guess i pistol whip and have the underworld talent and i off heal myself so i tend to have it up quite a bit im not saying that gunslingers verson isnt better but since i can spam it twice or 3 times if i stack it b4 fight then pistol whip

 

If you use it before the fight, you're wasting energy. You're supposed to dot targets up first with your dots and THEN use wounding shot. That's the wounding shot mechanic.

[Loklamone]

this thread said that this tree is useless i dont think it is useless. i do agree it is underpowered but it does suit my needs and style of play just fine. I like to have attacks and abilities for multiple situations. I also like to heal so i didnt go gunslinger, as of now i can do aoe and spread dot damage out to multiple targets and heal as well. so im doing damage and healing and i can aoe slow groups i can keep people from capping objectives. I like the mechanics of the tree it doesnt do as much damage as scrapper thats for sure but i dont like chaseing people around trying to get back blasts

 

had to type this in a hurry at work so sorry if it takes some reading to make sence of it

[Auxili]

this thread said that this tree is useless i dont think it is useless. i do agree it is underpowered but it does suit my needs and style of play just fine. I like to have attacks and abilities for multiple situations. I also like to heal so i didnt go gunslinger, as of now i can do aoe and spread dot damage out to multiple targets and heal as well. so im doing damage and healing and i can aoe slow groups i can keep people from capping objectives. I like the mechanics of the tree it doesnt do as much damage as scrapper thats for sure but i dont like chaseing people around trying to get back blasts

 

had to type this in a hurry at work so sorry if it takes some reading to make sence of it

 

Makes perfect sense. I just hope they make the tree stand on its own, the way it does for gunslinger.

[Preeebs]

It requiring upper hand means its up less often. other upper-hand attacks do just as much damage too so may as well use those, you dont really benefit from using wounding shot

 

just specced into DF, but im whondering what other upper hands attack a DF scoundrel has?

 

Again, i have not tested it yet, but do wounding shot realy do that little dmg on a target fully dotted?

[Auxili]

just specced into DF, but im whondering what other upper hands attack a DF scoundrel has?

 

Again, i have not tested it yet, but do wounding shot realy do that little dmg on a target fully dotted?

 

It essentially does the same damage as other shots that require upper hand. It does 50% less damage than the gunslinger variant.

 

Bioware doesnt like dirty fighting scoundrels, apparently. They want us all to spec either sawbones or scrapper, even though scrapper will get nerfed due to qq

[Preeebs]

ok, but what other upper hands attacks do a DF scoundrel have? Realy just asking here since when i was scrapper i used upperhand on sucker punch. But a DF scoundrel dont have that spell.

 

So what upper hand attacks do we have? I know its an aoe attack, but that dont do that high dmg.

[Auxili]

the issue also lies with how difficult it is to gain upper hand as a pure dirty fighting scoundrel. scrappers have great talents that make sucker punch much better than wounding shots and it is much more efficient.

[Preeebs]

yeah, but sucker punch is realy the only other upper hand attack we have. and most DF dont have that ability.

 

with 2 points in Exploratory surgery i dont find it hard to get upper hand. Also have pistol whip.

 

Personly im going for a sawbones and DF hybrid build. Since im a jack of all trade person. Medpack mastery also going to help me with upper hand procs.

 

And from the little experience i have with wounding shots it dont feel that bad tbh, should have abit longer range tho. feels kinda strange that i can shoot a bleed shot 30m, and trow a few granades 30 m, but that ability is only 10m. maby change it to shotgun ability?

Edited January 12, 2012 by Preeebs

[KoenigNord]

I had that kind of hybrid tree in mind but didn't tried it so far. Does is work well in warzones?

 

You can build up to 2 upper hands. So it's not that much. But I didn't expect DF to be killing a lot. The over all damage in warzones is huge, but you don't see the effect right away, thats how dots work. You need some patience. The good thing about this is, that most enemy players won't see you as a thread. They will hot those, who do immense damage or heal.

Also:

Bowbeater: +18% dmg w/ Vital Shot

Anatomy Lessons: -4 energy costs for Vital Shot

 

These will make me spread the pain on almost any enemy. I just have to look where to put my Dot finisher to make it even worse. The Upper Hands from Underworld Medicine might be quiet good, since the class is squishy.