Republic Ghost Town

[ChrisJSY]

Bioware already has the numbers and they're aware how bad the faction imbalance is. It's their decision if they want to start caring about the issue.

 

Being aware and doing something about it are two seperate things.

The fact is this imbalance was apparent through metrics in beta over a year ago .

 

I'm going to stick with trusting in what actions I've seen so far than a whisper of a hope.

[bicuspid]

Just adding my agreement to this. I'm on a HEAVY population server, but there's less than 20 republic on Voss, Ilum, Correllia. A search from my imperial character shows about 60 on those zones for Sith.

 

It's not a matter of 'republic level up slowly' either (which was such a illogical argument to begin with). I did a search on Taris and we have 40 people while the equivalent for Empire, Balmorra, has over 100. So yeah, lowbies are even more slated to the Sith side.

 

The problem, like others have said, is that we are at the point where not only new players are rolling sith because they're so much cooler, but republic players are ALSO rerolling since they cant even get their flashpoints done. The chances you find a group for a flashpoint when there are 40 people on the fleet of varying levels is almost 0%. Whereas I never see less than 120 people in the fleet on my Sith character on the same server.

 

 

PvP is one thing, but now the population imbalance is affecting PvE. Group quests with 20 people in the zone during prime time? Good luck with that.

 

 

This problem will get worse over time. Lets say you are a new player.

 

1) There is a built in higher probability you will roll sith, for the same reasons which have led to this imbalance.

2) If you were introduced to this game from a friend, it is more likely they are sith, so you will be sith.

3) If you do roll republic for some reason, you will either

- stop playing/reroll because you can't even get a group to do esseles because there are 40 people on the fleet

- stop playing/reroll because you are tired of being the only republic player in this supposedly galatic super power, and getting ganked 3 vs 1 all the time

- Tough it out, get to 50, then stop playing/reroll because there is no end game because the attrition rate was so high before getting to 50

 

 

If you rolled Sith, there would be no reason to reroll republic. Maybe because you want to 'fight the good fight' against numerous enemies, but eventually you'll realize playing with no one is a lot less fun than playing with a lot of people.

 

I think they really screwed up by letting the Warhammer guys anywhere near this game because it has the same problems with too many servers on launch and huge pop imbalance. Mythic apparently learned nothing from their failure of a game. Also whoever came up with the classes, should have seen right then and there that the cool factor was entirely lopsided. And the fact they didn't and no one else did either is not a good indicator of design talent.

 

Trooper vs Bounty Hunter - Who is going to be a regular generic grunt that dies by the hundreds, when they can be boba fett?

 

Smuggler vs Agent - Smuggler does okay because of Han. Agent is still very cool. The closest in terms of class appeal.

 

Jedi Sage/Shadow vs Sith Sorcerer/Assassin - "Sage"? "Shadow"? Really? Those was the best names you could think of? No chance for the republic here.

 

Jedi Guardian/Sentinel vs Sith Juggernaut/Marauder - See above. I don't care what the game is, if I have the choice to be a 'Juggernaut' I'd take it over being a 'Guardian'.

 

From character creation, Sith has all the cool factor.

Edited January 16, 2012 by bicuspid

[SingleCoilPickup]

I was on Tatooine last night for about two hours in the hopes of finding some Republic to spar with. I found one. And he was AFK.

 

I even went to the Outlaw's Den. Empty.

 

I went up to all of the Republic bases. Empty.

 

I trolled around Judland and the Dune Sea. Empty.

 

I even resorted to camping some Republic mission locations. Empty.

 

I'm an Imperial, and I do want to clarify we're not all the "l337 pwn n00bs" types. While I'm a Sith Inquisitor, I make all light side decisions and am Light IV. So not all of us are just like "we want to be evil and shock peepz lolz."

 

In any case, population balance is a really big problem right now, and I really hope Bioware starts doing something to incentivize rolling Republic characters.

[Zolinar]

It was so bad the imbalance that as republic you cant do missions without a getting ganked in the newbie areas. dead in 4 seconds at level 20 buy 40 and 50s.

[tonbery]

On the serious note, Republic does need something as cool going for them in order to have increase in faction numbers.

 

I can't really think of any other incentive for the Republic. The empire has the Sith, which are just all around cooler (cool looking gear, ships, dark story). This seems to be the popular opinion, so the Republic side will need something to turn the tide.

 

Faction transfers would also give a little incentive, because people don't want to start over.

[Lord_Karsk]

On twitter and dev interview all the devs talk about how they play their EMPIRE CLASSES.

Bioware have for 2 years before the game came out been talking about mostly the Empire.

Events videos, even the raid dev video they made qas of Empire players.They are pro Empire. Thats why the Empire have betterstories and planets.Pretty clear they started working on the Empire faction first.And now they pay the price with a huge faction imbalance, op Empire classes on some ac and with people stating to leaving.

[Vlacke]

It would be helpful if people started putting names of the server where they play and where imbalance is already a HUGE problem.

Also the other way around, places where imbalance isn't so catastrophic.

 

I will repeat myself when i say that they need to make one cool Republic exclusive playable alien race for a start.

 

The ideas were either Togruta, or Ke'lDor or Nautolan, either of those would increase the popularity of the faction instantly, especially for newcomer players, hell even a Wookie for all i care.

 

Also when i mentioned Yoda's race before i was joking obviously, but something like that would be exactly what the Republic faction needs at the moment.

 

Improved armor design also wouldn't hurt, but that alone wouldn't help right now.

[Zalanox]

I really tried to play Republic, but it's just not worth it. I like playing with other people.

[bicuspid]

It would be helpful if people started putting names of the server where they play and where imbalance is already a HUGE problem.

Also the other way around, places where imbalance isn't so catastrophic.

 

 

Vulkar Highway. At least 2.5 to 1. Make a level 1 and search any zone to verify. We're lucky in that at least we have enough republics during prime time to get quests done, and we have a handful of PvP guilds rolling Sith in premades but if its not prime time, good luck finding a group for your herioc 4 in a zone with 20 repubs.

Edited January 16, 2012 by bicuspid

[Auxili]

republic players are ALSO rerolling since they cant even get their flashpoints done. The chances you find a group for a flashpoint when there are 40 people on the fleet of varying levels is almost 0%. Whereas I never see less than 120 people in the fleet on my Sith character on the same server.

 

 

PvP is one thing, but now the population imbalance is affecting PvE. Group quests with 20 people in the zone during prime time? Good luck with that.

 

 

This problem will get worse over time.

 

Precisely! It affects all aspects of gameplay. I've written about it here:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=180516

[Auxili]

On twitter and dev interview all the devs talk about how they play their EMPIRE CLASSES.

Bioware have for 2 years before the game came out been talking about mostly the Empire.

Events videos, even the raid dev video they made qas of Empire players.They are pro Empire. Thats why the Empire have betterstories and planets.Pretty clear they started working on the Empire faction first.And now they pay the price with a huge faction imbalance, op Empire classes on some ac and with people stating to leaving.

Yeah I read that interview a while ago. It's despicable and worrying for us republic players, who haven't gotten any love since Beta began.

 

Bioware, it's your turn to have some input in this discussion.

[SingleCoilPickup]

It would be helpful if people started putting names of the server where they play and where imbalance is already a HUGE problem.

Also the other way around, places where imbalance isn't so catastrophic.

 

I play on Dark Reaper and it really feels like it's at least 2.5 or 3 to 1.

[bicuspid]

I would say at this point, if you want to play republic and have an acceptable PvE experience, you need to roll on the highest population server you can find.

 

We on heavy servers are getting by 'okay' in terms of finding groups. And we still need to look for a while during prime time as there are like 40 people max on worlds, 90 on the fleet. If you're on a standard or light server, that probably means there are like 10 people or less on most planets and 0 chance to getting stuff done or having anything close to a MMO experience.

 

 

Honestly what they should do is shut down half the servers and move the players to other servers. We'd still have the crazy pop imbalance, but at least republic can GET STUFF DONE because there would be more than a handful of people in zones. You cannot do herioc 4's in a zone with 10 people bioware.

 

 

That's the other problem with this game. The servers have like no capacity or something. Even in the early days of WoW when alliance outnumbered us 2:1 on our server, we had enough horde around to DO everything. We could still have an economy/clear all the raids/put up some fight in world PvP at least until the zerg fully arrived. Right now on HEAVY servers it feels like we're struggling to do these things, so I can only imagine how bad it is for republic on standard or light servers.

Edited January 16, 2012 by bicuspid

[Auxili]

Jung Ma, around 2:1 pop in starting zones, fleet, ilum, and so forth. Empire side is much livelier, filled with LFGs and so forth.

[NogFizzbin]

I always thought that the empire faction should have been a free-for-all (FFA) faction - once they leave the starting planet of course. That would go a long way to solve the faction ratio (or make it irrelevant) on pvp servers.

[Staavis_SC]

Just a personal opinion here, but this was my experience:

 

While attempting to identify a "main" for ourselves, the girlfriend and I rolled Republic first. We certainly enjoyed the Smuggler and the Trooper, but the girlfriend certainly didn't enjoy the Jedi, and I found major issues keeping my Jedi Knight alive.

 

So then we rolled Empire.

 

Holy. Cow.

 

Bounty Hunters? WAY FUN!!! I know, mechanically the same as Trooper, right? But it's all about the presentation. The story for the BH seems better than the Trooper, and the animations and attacks you have, are totally AWESOME compared to the Trooper?

 

Oh, and Imperial Agent Bond. James Bond. Yeah. Pretty darn awesome as well.

 

Oh, and the Girlfriend is enjoying her Sith Inquisitor (again, presentation) over her Jedi Consular.

 

Maybe, just maybe, the reason Empire is currently winning on the population front, is because Bioware didn't make the Republic side nearly as cool as the Empire side.

 

I know, tin foil hat and all.

 

But I gotta say, having played a fair amount on both sides, I feel the following is true:

 

Some stories are infinitely better on Empire.

Armor looks way cooler on Empire.

Attacks / Spells / Powers seem better animated and much more enjoyable on Empire.

 

Most likely, the GF and I will be sticking to Empire for the time being. Not because of population or anything, but because we are having much more fun than we did with our Republic toons.

[Valishin]

First things first, the single most focused task of the empire is to destroy the rebels and their so called republic. As such, this all seems to be working out just fine.

 

 

Second there is an actual solution to this and it revolves around understanding why so many people gravitated toward the empire. The reality is quite simple that based on what we know about the SW story line players that want interesting bad arse in your face attitude characters will bee line straight for the empire, and like it or not that seems to be the trend for players today.

 

So then the question becomes how do you maintain the integrity of the story line where jedi are (baby stealing) goody goody monks which is not particularly appealing to many players even if they are just as powerful as their counterparts. Well the answer is quite simple. First accept that 2 factions was not a great idea. With that in mind if you were going to add a 3rd faction and you wanted to balance out the sides what qualities should your new faction have? Well it seems to me that the edgy agressiveness of empire is its major draw. So what other group in the SW universe do we know that is edgy and agressive with enough "cool" factor to draw away players from the wanna kick the universe's arse faction? I think it is quite simple, we need Mandalorians as a faction.

 

If BW were smart they would go ahead and announce that as their plan for the first major expansion which in all fairness would not happen any time soon but at least it would be a long term resolution to the balance issue. In the short term they could implement some balancing efforts but not too much otherwise you will wake up one day and the republic will own the galaxy instead of being crushed under the emperor's heal where they belong.

 

 

Oh, and they need to merge servers until the population increases enough to justify readding servers.

[Auxili]

This fact is not only being discussed on the forum.

 

It's being spoken about constantly on reddit, in-game, and on other websites.

 

http://r2-db.com/article-rss/23309/star-wars-the-old-faction-imbalance

[Vlacke]

I play on Chuundar and the ratio is about 2:1 for the Empire, probably even more, the server is well populated though so the Republic numbers over there are probably bigger than on some other servers but still nowhere near the numbers of the Empire faction.

[Staavis_SC]

First things first, the single most focused task of the empire is to destroy the rebels and their so called republic. As such, this all seems to be working out just fine.

 

 

Second there is an actual solution to this and it revolves around understanding why so many people gravitated toward the empire. The reality is quite simple that based on what we know about the SW story line players that want interesting bad arse in your face attitude characters will bee line straight for the empire, and like it or not that seems to be the trend for players today.

 

So then the question becomes how do you maintain the integrity of the story line where jedi are (baby stealing) goody goody monks which is not particularly appealing to many players even if they are just as powerful as their counterparts. Well the answer is quite simple. First accept that 2 factions was not a great idea. With that in mind if you were going to add a 3rd faction and you wanted to balance out the sides what qualities should your new faction have? Well it seems to me that the edgy agressiveness of empire is its major draw. So what other group in the SW universe do we know that is edgy and agressive with enough "cool" factor to draw away players from the wanna kick the universe's arse faction? I think it is quite simple, we need Mandalorians as a faction.

 

If BW were smart they would go ahead and announce that as their plan for the first major expansion which in all fairness would not happen any time soon but at least it would be a long term resolution to the balance issue. In the short term they could implement some balancing efforts but not too much otherwise you will wake up one day and the republic will own the galaxy instead of being crushed under the emperor's heal where they belong.

 

 

Oh, and they need to merge servers until the population increases enough to justify readding servers.

 

Adding a third faction isn't likely to "balance" the population.

 

All it will do is create 2 main factions (Mandalorians and Empire) with a 3rd sub-faction (Republic).

 

I'd imagine you';d see something like 45% Empire, 35% Manadlorian and 20% Republic.

 

How does that solve the problem?

 

And besides, the Mandalorians aren't the solution. The solution is...the Cartels.

 

Take BH and Smuggler out of Republic / Empire and put them into the Cartels faction. A completely neutral go anywhere do anything faction. Perhaps add a new "assassin" class (or even a Mandalorian class) to fill out the Rogues gallery. Then, create a true Imperial Trooper for the Empire, an SIS agent for the Republic to fill the gaps left by pulling out the smugglers and bounty hunters.

 

tada!

 

For the people that like Rogues, you have the Cartels, with a very "Hutt" centric story.

 

For the rest, they choose between the faction they like most, without the influence of Bounty Hunters being on one side. (We know this is likely part of the problem. Everyone wants to be Boba Fett)

 

With a little work and some slight improvements, Republic can be made as good as Empire, and the population will balance itself.

[Graveside]

The hutt cartel isn't always on the Republics or the Empires side...so why is it that all toons have to choose a side?

 

Can there not be any rogue Jedi Knights or Sith Marauders? BH's that take no side but their own...more like a neutral side in the game. This would remind me of DAoC - one side starts getting to strong the other two sides team up to stop it...and the viscious cycle continues.

 

I am all for a 3 side concept...2 sides in today's MMO is old and just plain bad.

 

A Prime Example - only 4 Republic servers loss at the end...it was mostly empire that was out numbered.

 

http://tagn.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/screenshot0121.jpg

Edited January 16, 2012 by Graveside

[zerosaint]

 

I am all for a 3 side concept...2 sides in today's MMO is old and just plain bad.

 

This is what made MxO such a fun game. 3 Factions (5 actually with two of the factions splintered). There was always allegiance shifting that caused pvp to stay interesting.

[Vlacke]

One of the problems of the faction imbalance lies also in the fact that a Jedi Consular is sub par to the Inquisitor in just about every department in my opinion, voice acting, vase and dishes throwing compared to lightning barbecue, better armor design.

Inquisitors have vast numbers, by far the most popular class even on the Empire side it tends to be like three Inquisitors to one of every other class, lightning everywhere and the famous unlimited powaah thing that obviously a lot of people liked.

[Putok]

Most of the empire mirrors are just more appealing.

 

Trooper vs BH, we're talking about the SW equivalent of a red shirt vs Boba Fett. The difference in "cool factor" is absolutely monumental.

 

Agent vs Smuggler, space James Bond vs Han Solo. A bit more of a tossup in terms of cool factor, but the agent has the advantage of being something new and unique in the universe.

 

When it comes to force users, and aesthetics, versatility, and story of the Sith is just worlds ahead of the Jedi. Sith look cooler, the stories are a bit more unconvential and less Mary Sue. The gear looks way, way, way better.

 

Empire space ships look better for the most part.

 

So, we have an issue of cooler mirrors, better looking gear, and better story.

 

It'd take a pretty big carrot to overcome that. I'm thinking add some more races and cooler races for the republic (Where are togruta, cathar, and mon cal? The models are in the game and fully functional, and they speak basic. Are they just hanging onto them so they can release them later as "new" content?) would help, but I have a feeling that something more substantive will be needed. Bonuses to experience, valor, and credits earned would be a decent start.

[DocVandar]

I am all for a 3 side concept...2 sides in today's MMO is old and just plain bad.

 

Unfortunately it is too late to implement an entirely new third faction. This is something that would have had to have been planned from the start.

 

I have seen the problem of population imbalance first hand and personally think it is TOR's biggest problem at the moment. I am not at lvl 50 yet, but I have Republic and Imperial toons on several PvP servers and have seen the drastic advantage the Empire will have in Ilum (once it is fixed) and other open-world PvP.

 

The best suggestion I have seen thus far to get players over to the Republic, and one that I will continue to push, is allow more alien-like playable species for the Republic only -- Kel Dor, Togruta, Nautolan, etc. I think this is a great way, that has zero effect on actual game play, to incentivize players rolling Republic.