The Uninvited - Given to those classes that nobody wants in their raids.

The Free to Player The Preferred The Subscriber

PVE servers are that way.

Not sure if excited or worried to see what gets said on Monday.

i chortled as well

Yeah we were having this discussion in the Questions thread. Probably should have made your recommendations there. As of this point the hope is that Devs respond to our current questions. While veng dps is questioned, it certainly isn't in a way that everyone would like it fixed.

I reserve spitting on corpses for those that camp lowbie areas. Otherwise, I kill and move on.

Very nice addition Rob

I disagree with that assessment of needing to nerf the base dmg. I was looking over one my my combat logs on Torparse which was was around 2800dps and didn't have a "great" proc rate of ravage which is what I want since I'd leave the Rampage proc at 30% since i'm making up the dps via bleeds. The length of fight was 500 secs (yes long but still useful). I did 1,388,714 total dmg which is 2777 (close enough to 2800). In order to hit 3000 dps I would need to increase my overall dmg to 1,500,000 (3k/dps * 500s). So we'd have have to make up ~111k worth of dmg over 500 secs. My bleeds were as follows: 37,643 60,590 140,749 ---------- 238,982 In order to make up 111k worth of dmg on the bleeds we'd need the bleeds to increase by ~46.5%. Another alternative is that they possibly increase the base dmg of Impale, Shatter, FS within the Veng From Logs Impale 209,741 Shatter 91,282 FS 209,307 Total 510,330 Need 617,499 to achieve 3k dps That would mean increasing dmg of Impale, Shatter & FS by 21%. Finally we could have a combination of increasing the base dmg and increasing the bleed dmg. Again, this is more theoretical possible alternatives to "fixing" the Veng tree and making it more competitive with other dps classes.

Boy please say this is actually resolved tomorrow. Been experiencing this recently and is super annoying during raids.

But again the problem is if you fix Rampage proc, we are still a fixed position dps class which will never compete with ranged or more mobile melee classes in end game raid content. Go through all the boss fights and list out each mechanic which would cause an interruption in ravage which means dps loss. Most bosses have at minimum 1 if not 2 mechanics (or more) which would cause ravage interruption. If we are given a dps boost on bleeds we are not hurt as much with mechanic interrupts. Your classifying it as a annihilation jug is pretty accurate which i don't see as a bad thing

Yup. Just make sure there isn't a dev response that says, "Just DPS to full."

Which is what i'm suggesting. Up the dmg done by our 3 bleeds and leave the Rampage proc alone. That way we can achieve a consistent high dps regardless of the rampage proc. Should we get lucky with rampage proc, we just be a little more "spikey" than normal. So thinking that if the dmg on bleeds were upped so that we could maintain a consistent 2900ish dps on a dummy but if we get rampage proc lucky we could possibly spike as high as 3200 which would put us closer to some of the better dps classes.

But then you are stuck with a class that needs to be stationary to achieve max dps. That doesn't work for melee classes. Why do you think Marauders are so much better? Because they can dps on the move.

I'm not necessarily concerned with how it's achieved, but I believe that increasing the bleeds is Veng best way to keep up with other dps classes.

Respawn appears to be bugged. Only spawns on an actual server reset/patch day. After it is killed it no longer spawns. Makes getting my Champion of Taris achievements hard to finish.

Having been thinking about Vengeance the last couple of nights, I almost think we would have been better off asking for an increase in our 3 bleeds in order for us to be more DPS capable. The reason I say that is even if you ask for the devs to revisit Rampage proc, Vengeance is still terrible if we have to move which is just about every boss fight. If you increase the bleed dmgs then you allow Vengeance to be more capable in overall dps but we then become a dps class that can dps on the move and not rely on standing still for ravage.

I'll look at it more in depth, but ditch the 4 piece vindicator and go with the 2/2. Why you may ask? Look at Ravage %/dmg vs Force Scream %/dmg. With the 8% increase in scream on the vindicator you were only able to match the dmg of ravage. I did the math calculation and just by swapping the 8% around you will automatically be higher. Then you add the fact that ravage has the possibility to proc 3x vs 1 on FS, the overall dmg will be much higher Here is one of mine. Tried to parse as close to your time as I could. 2829dps http://www.torparse.com/a/405061/1/0/Damage+Dealt Have you tried parsing without using saber throw in your rotation? Also notice that i have 30 hits of Ravage vs your 24, so looks like you are not using Ravage as much as you should. I'm using Vicious Slash more than you. I'm guessing it's in place of your saber throw. That would explain why i have more of the Force Lash than you. Do you have all your Strength/Will Power and +10 datacron? every little bit helps. Seeing that my overall crit % is higher which will help with the dps. 34.26 vs 29.84

can you give us your full stats. I see you are using a proc relic. Which one? I use the underworld boundless ages relic.

having played both, i ended up sticking with Rage. More consistent single target dmg and way better aoe dmg.

Update: Metalsaber (Pot5) 17065 Achievement Points http://imgur.com/gEVHUsN

Still making assumptions I see. It's ok. I accept your apology.

I was quoting the person who proved that there were 7 and the op couldn't count. You made the ASSumption that I was agreeing with the OP. Keep up sparky.

Referring to the OP, but continue with your silliness.

counting is hard haha