Except for the last sentence i agree with you. The tool would generate exactly that sort of things Making extremely easy to access content to players without preparation, getting onto content that they can't handle, leads to the players complain that the content is too hard, which leads to the said tuning down of difficulty. When an random player raid or ops has almost 100% chance to complete the end-game, the content simply looses appeal, and the demand of more content grows exponentially. End-game should always be something that took knowing your class well, preparation, but most of all coordination between a group of players. Actually no, as the heroics had to be tuned way down so that people would be able to do it with a high success rate. Those same 2 hit mechanics became 4 hit mechanics, fire and void zones didn't kill you anymore in 2-3 ticks, and a lot of other examples. And those same players that didn't understood their classes and roles after that phase, passed the symptom to the raids. Mages with 400 dps, warlocks, shamans, you name it, wanted to go for end-game content, so that same content was tuned down again and again. More players pass through the content, but has it brought more interest or longevity to the game? For what i understand a lot of players play the game out of habit than enjoyment. Leveling class after class to get some reason to log in, because once they hit maximum level they need very little time to run all end-game and get most BiS. And don't need to be a no-live, it is simply too easy for everyone. Normal mode ops being completed by a random group, it's understandable. Hard or above? That is the part i have difficulty accepting.

I do think that the server consolidation and in-server lfd tool would be the best of all alternatives. I re-rolled on a different server because the server i was on passed from high population, on the pre-launch, to low. It took a long time to get into pvp even. I'm still level 44 at the moment, and have had more fun since the change. It is not only the easiness to get something rolling, by comparison, the universe seems more alive (and sometimes laggy ). As for a lf ops or hard content, it would have to be linked to some sort of account id, legacy for example, friends/ignore lists.

I must say that i simply love this game, the 2 stories i followed so far (consular and trooper) are simply amazing. With that in mind, i would like to discuss an idea that would improve a lot imho the game value. The idea is basically to tie the pve gear evolution to the storyline. Something in the form of an advanced class storyline. The hard mode flashpoints, ops and some open world would become the base for it. Off rooms are plenty in most flashpoints, so it would be possible with some work to install a system that would allow a team to have each their storyline objective, while maintaining the base of the flashpoint itself. If only part of the slots would tied to the class story, and part to the flashpoint itself, the need for both would increase the probability that a certain flashpoint would be in demand. Having like 4-5 armor pieces, and possibly the weapon, as those are the ones that mark the class choices, connected to an evolving storyline would be counter-balanced by the need for the rest of the gear, that would be on the domain of the hard mode flashpoints and operations loot. I understand that it would require 8 storylines to be introduced for each new expansion but, if done right would increase the game longevity.

I was a bit tired when i constructed the post, so the message might have taken a slight different meaning than the one intended. English not being my primary language helps to be a bit hard to express my points of view sometimes. That being said, one of the prime factors I, personally, consider a bad idea is that, if applied, a x-lfd tool on end content will turn this game in what happened in other games. People don't like the "hamster wheel" feeling that is automatically the result of that. In WoW, for example, the number of instances made raised, but due to the nature of the grouping with random people that same content had to be tuned way down, and the item currency stretched so that people would have to be on the wheel longer. I haven't played WoW for a long time now, but have friends that do. What i see, in the way the game turned into, is simply is not appealing. Since highest level (i believe it's 85) all they do when logged is queue after queue for heroic mode instances, or raids. Yes, people group faster, but do they enjoy the content? Most of them only think in the last boss "phat lewt". The people that enjoy that sort of game play are the ones that, usually, demand such tools. Is that a good thing for companies? Maybe, for a short while. In the long run? Not really, as it makes the game boring. In a leveling setting, a lfd tool, might actually bring some benefits. As an end-game tool it would simply foster the "hamster wheel" mentality, forcing it on everyone else. Asunasan says it in a very clear way in: I know... the argument of "if you don't like it, don't use it". That is a moot argument in my opinion, as it will be the norm, not the exception. ---- You are confusing friendship with trust there. --- As a primarily pvp player you see the question that way, but a pve player would see it exactly the opposite way. This would be more on the lines a pve player would write: --- Neither should they, as it would become pointless to run said content. --- NOTE to Touchbass: Even though i keep referencing to you in my posts i do it most out of respect, as you seem one of the few with opposing points of view that can expose them in a constructive way.

Besides the heroic 4 quests it's basically the only place that players group. But in the opposition of the heroic 4 quests they last longer, hence giving a chance of having an idea of a certain player. Little things, like greeting your group mates, asking if anyone need some info on a boss between many others, set aside some people that might be of interest to a social person. A x-lfd would simply make impossible to establish a contact with that player again, save in some great luck it happens to be from your server. Not everyone likes to rush mindlessly through content, which is what happens with an anonymous x-lfd tool every time as a side effect. How many people in real live, from all the people one knows, can someone say that are REAL friends? We deal with them, with bigger or lesser care for them, but are they REAL friends? Most of them, not really. They are work colleagues, school, sports, whatever. They might not fit exactly on the category but still they are friends. And because of them we evolve. In an online game that is what matters to some, not if you are tall, short, fat, slim, but the ability and willingness (more the later than the former most times) to cooperate with others for a common objective.

I understand the problem you refer in your post, but then again there is the reverse side of the coin. I bet that most of the players that are claiming that there is no alternative to x-lfg don't even have a single player tagged as a friend. That in itself is one of the major problems in the latest years in the new-mmo community. In every game i passed there are always anti-social people around, but that problem has been aggravated in the recent years. Nowadays most players just want to get to the end of an instance without even have the trouble of reading about it, and if something goes wrong they simply blame the others in the group for their failure. They usually blame the healer for not keeping them alive when they don't move from hazards, tanks for not holding the off-mob that they shouldn't be attacking, and many other noobish stuff. How many of the claimers for a x-lfg and "there is no community" mantra have even tried to get to know other players? Most of them don't even have a single player in their friend list. A community wont fall in their lap, it has to be catered to grow and evolve. Half the people i grouped for the heroic missions didn't even bothered to say hi in party chat, but a few of those whined if by any chance they die. Lobbying the game with a x-lfg tool would aggravate that situation even more if applied for end-game content. Nowadays we don't even need to log to the game to get a raid going, that is why BW created the guild hosting services. So the answer is not that hard to figure out if the players try to organize themselves into working guilds. But it's too much of an hassle to try to know the server's player base for a good part of the players. Just some food for thought: How come some of the most anti-social players in the mmo's are the ones that have 100+ people on their facebook account that they have never met, but are unable to get to know a single player in the game? That is the base of the "there is no community" mantra.

It's not really hard to have evolution with my 2-3h a day of play, i could do all that the other players do, and not be that constrained by the lack of time. As long as people try to know the community in their servers, there is always a good chance that sooner or later it would advance the gear and professions to the level of the more active players. Just because some players think they should get all without the effort, doesn't mean that the ones that can do it in an organized fashion wont be more deserving to complete end-game. What counts is not the amount of play time, is how each one makes the use of it. And once again, x-lfg for normal modes, sure, harder settings, no thank you. The only thing that WoW got from cross realm anonymous queue was a big loss in interest from the community, which once the tool was installed simply vanished. -Players without a clue of what to do would get into raids, getting carried by the others. -Master loot ninjaing -kicking people when the boss is at 5% health to not having to compete with players of the same class for loot Those and many other "side effects" where what it brought to WoW. Nowadays WoW for the top levels is sitting in Stormwind/Orgrimar until the lfg tool gets them the 9/24 players to do something. The chat is childish, no one know each other, but hey... everyone got EPIX. If and when someone gets something that takes real effort to get, that someone like to be recognized as someone that has done something that is not usually easy to do. In an RPG that means better gear to demonstrate the achievement, titles that are hard to get and the like. When every single player has it it's not special anymore, it's common place, which defeats the purpose of it.

I forgot to mention the "if you don't like the x-lfg don't use it" mantra in my previous post. The problem with that statement is that once it is implemented it becomes mandatory. That is not an option to not use it, because as soon as it is implemented the option to gather a group to run FP's or ops ceases to exist, except in guilds with enough people to do them. Another point i must refer to is (and i bet that the few "loud" people in the thread will be offended by it) if someone don't have time to run end game content as it should be done, why should that someone have access to that sort of gear "just because they pay the same as the others"? The way i see things, if someone want something should work for it, not get it as a certain thing. And certain self stylized """""casuals"""""" play more than many of the ones they accuse from being hard-core players. It is those sort of people that complain that the game is too hard to get the top notch gear but, once they get their way, those same people say the game don't have enough content and they are bored - that is ALWAYS the way thing happen when a company caves to the demands of ex-FPS/ex-console players/single player god mode players and the like. And again i say, normal modes x-lfg tool can be good, end game content it is a disaster.

Before i start i must say that imho a x-lfg can be a good, and a bad thing depending on how it is implemented. As i see it, it has the benefit of easier grouping, with the downside of having most of the bad players (from ninjas to griefers) being catered for, with no accountability whatsoever. But the biggest problem in the 116 pages of this thread so far is that most of the people that asks for a x-lfg tool don't even understand what an MMO is and even less what a RPG is. As for the former that is a hard thing to define, since there are many interpretations of it. For some people it is a gathering place, for others a way to get their e-pen exercised. There are many ways to gather a large number of players to "exist" in a determined setting and usually they give that setting the definition of MMO. As for the RPG part, that is where the thing gets complicated, as most of the "new player generation" don't even have a clue about what it mean realy. As an RPGer from long time, from pen-and-paper, to board games, card games, and of course computer games I have a few words to say about the meaning of it. In a "conventional" RPG the amount of effort is offset by the quality of the rewards gained. What was made in WoW, and a few other games, was to take away the effort/reward ratio based on the whining of people that wanted the later without the former. This started long before the x-lfg tools, but got much aggravated with the introduction of the tool, as content was tuned down, so that every one had the chance to get the top gear without the trouble to get it. Still remember seeing a "purple item" and thinking "wow, i need to get better to be able to get it". Nowadays, it is common place, the "epic" just became common place, a niche occupied in the not too far back by the uncommon gear (the called green items). Even creating various ranks in the "epics" the reward >>>>> effort to get it. As i see it, x-lfg might work in a normal leveling system, but should never be implemented on the hard modes or operations. those should require enough coordination to require a pre-made group with communication to be able to complete.