He also wrote less then 5 seconds. 5 seconds = 3 abilities within GCD. My Fully rakata geared scrapper crits around 3.2k-4k with Shoot First 2.3k-3.1k with backblast and 2.2k-3k with blaster whip. this is if the abilities crit which only happens around 40% of the time. The chance of all 3 abilities critting is quite low. And also I need to be on a squishy target to actually deal damage. So this means that rakata geared operatives are OP against newly dinged squishy healers, because I dont believe any good geared people could run around with only 10k health

We cant stealth in combat. We can vanish into stealth which means we jump out of combat. Its a 3min (2 if talented, IIRC) cooldown. In addition every class and their mothers dog has an AoE ability which is next to instant. So if you let a target run away in stealth it means your reactiontiming was too slow. Now read the above example I gave you and it should be clear to you that the reason why Rogue classes has vanish is becaue they cant survive a fight otherwise. Its the whole idea of the class. It would be equal to removing the class itself. What you are asking for is a freekill once you survived the opener of rogue classes. It was the exact same in Rift, World of Warcraft and Everquest AFAIK so I dont know which games you are talking about.

Not talking to you, dont worry Talking to the disrespectful people throwing QQ, L2p etc comments.

For people to understand MMORPGs they need to understand basic RPG which is based on DnD and pen and paper games. You have the usual classes which serve their purpose: Warriors: The heavy armor sword wielding soldier who jumps directly into the fight, can survive the fight, and stays in there until he dies Mage: Stays out of range, or on highground to avoid being kiled, wearing nothing but robes, they would die almost instantly. Rogue: Uses stealth to get close to a target, since they are melee, in addition, they rely on heavy damage to "assassinate" targets. Different form of classes appear but they all follow one rule: The more damage the less survivability/ The More survivability the less damage Example: An archer is a rogue class. It has been granted the ability of superior range as its utility to survive, does not have stealth, and in addition also relies on high damage low survivability. A paladin is a warrior class with mage assets. It has been granted superior survivability but has low damage. Rogue > Mage Mage > Warrior Warrior > Rogue A Rogue cant kill a warrior because of the survivability of the warrior. it would be equal to fighting a soldier in iron armor and a broadsword not wearing anything else than a dagger. A Mage cant kill a rogue because of the lack of survivability from the mage. The mage relies on the ability to stay far away whilst the rogue relies on close combat: but because the rogue is in control of when they enter combat, they usually have the upper hand. A Warrior cant kill a Mage because of the lack of survivability. Having low mobility due to the heavy armor and no defence against magic, the warrior will have a hard time against this class. And thus a trinity is formed. Other form of trinities: Tank > Dps Dps > Healer Healer > Tank But this example is really based on the previous example as the Tank = warrior, Healer = Mage and Dps = Rogue. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Operative/Scoundrel was a class with Almost No survivability but in addition had huge damage to support it. Now with the nerf we have low to medium damage followed by zero to low survivability. Why are stealth classers picked on in MMORPGs? Because people base them on 1v1 terms whilst MMORPGs are in general based on RvR (Raid vs Raid). The idea of MMORPG is that you fight with friends in big battles. The idea of a warrior is to stay in the middle of a battle, be able to survive a beating whilst giving a beating themselves. The idea of a Rogue is to be able to remove 1 of the countless hundreds of targets that are in a RvR in hopes of changing the battle on the field. If a deadly mage is on a hilltop raining fire on everyone, its a Rogues job to remove that mage before the warriors die. So why is this a problem in SWTOR? Because people only care about themselves, not the big picture. They are too busy QQing about why they instantly died. Who to blame? Blizzard. World of Warcraft is the first MMORPG to go away from the oldschool RvR system and insted focus 1v1 balance, thus every current MMORPG'er believe that a Rogue class should not excist. So why is a rogue class needed? Because otherwise you have your immortal healer running around laughing at everyone unless he gets targeted by 4+. The whole idea of a rogue class is to have a character who lurks in the shadows and only strikes when needed. Its a tactical class and it is needed in the general balance of classes and combinations in a multiplayer game.

It still shocks me that people believe my thread is about me having issues gearing up. Its actually me asking to have an expertise free zone to pvp in ala a PvE'rs place to beat eachother: Just for the lulz. I am perfectly happy with my raidgear, Thank you. And my Companion is perfectly happy with her championset, Thank you. This pretty much boils down to two things. And its 100% subjective. I dont like games which require you to have different sets of items for different situations. it strikes me wierdly that Luke Skywalker would need 5min to switch to his pvp gear before fighting darth Vader (analogy). I want to be able to use my one set of clothing for all aspects of the game I am playing. Only time I would need to change gear is if I changed my specc (e,g dps to healer or tank to dps or dps focus on stat x to dps focus on stat y) In my opinion having a pvp specific stat ruins any form of competetive pvp unless you happen to be ontop of the pvp gearwheel yourself. One could argue this is the same for all kinds of gear but in my opinion, the game should have 1 line of progression with multiple ways to reach that goal. Also expertise is based on Resillience (WoW), which was added by blizzard as a bandage because blizzard failed to balance pve and pvp accordingly. It makes no sense that we use it here.

(Read the OP, I actually wrote that my previous suggestion was this) I actually had a long thread about this exact thing about 1 year ago on these forums. I wanted to disclude resillience/expertise like stats from the game and make a united set of gearing for all aspects of the game so that gearing up ment progression in the game and you could participate in any kind of activity as you want. But I got roflstomped by people who claimed the only right way to make an MMORPG is to divide pve and pvp. I still believe going with expertise was stupid. Blizzard added resillience as a bandage on their failed pve vs pvp balance. the fact that dps just got higher damage values and bosses only got higher healthpools mens that people could 3shot eachother by the end of vanilla: So they took the easy road and created resillience.

I have played alot of games over the years. I have played MMORPGs for over 8 years. I have enjoyed online gaming for 12 years. For me this resillience / expertise thing is not fun. It does not make player versus player combat fun for me. That is a subjective opinion. I fully understand that it may sound like this is what I am asking for. If they could balance out a warzone to co-exist with no gear differences, only your class and thats it, I would be up for it 100%, however I could see some issues knowing that people have geared for certain stats. Unless they auto config mods to appear as Value 50 with Armoring 126 for everyone who joins.

I wonder why people assume my post is QQ and that I am a undergeared newly dinged 50 who is crying about getting roflstomped. Not at all. I had a subjective opinion and I came to the forums hoping to discuss it. Am I 100% settled on my opinion? not at all. On page1 somone pointed out that the healthpool of newly dinged and rakata geared are very different and thus I agreed the suggestion I made was not so good to begin with. I do still however wish for a warzone for PvE'rs were we can goof around. It could be a rewardless warzone which only has one purpose: fun between PvE geared people.

Thank you very much. /) (\

This is not about farming expertise. I am perfectly happy with my raidgear, I would ask for a warzone were PvE'rs can fight eachother.

Just looked it up. I am indeed using the wrong word. I cannot remember how to spell the word I am looking for. I am looking for a word that means "will be a problem for the group and will drag it down due to not having the same equipment as them".

Can we please stop this disrespectful tone? Im far from whining, I suggested an opinion based on subjective experience on a forum where it could be discussed. I will add that i see the problems between newly dinged and rakata are far greater than the ones I had considered myself as I had only considered a few things myself. Being a dps I only considered the difference between the stats which I focus and not the healthpool. The healthpool does indeed make it a big difference. Personally I am asking for a place I can pvp with/against pve geared people. They can make it a non-rewardable zone, where the only thing you get out of it is lulz. I dont pvp for gear, I pvp for fun

I cant speak for others than myself, but having played online gaming for over 12 years, I feel its a reliability that I have to carry multiple sets of gear in my bag simply because I need the stat for certain situations. Hence the non expertise warzones.

Hello Not going to make a long and detailed post about this because it will end up with battlemasters telling me everyone who complains about expertise are bad pvpers. So il get right to it. Im tired of pvping being a preset match about "who got the most expertise". I allready played wow for 7 years, I dont need to experience this gear wheel one more damn time. Normally I would ask for expertise to be removed but some pvp'ers believe its perfectly fine to divide pve and pvp into two groups insted of just being one united happy family. But since that is subjective Im going to ask for the "in between" option: Simply give us a bracket which is for non expertise users. It should be created as such that expertise value equals 0 in this match so that people without expertise can have fun as well. The thing is, the difference between a newly dinged 50 and a rakata geared 50 is average iLvl 124 vs average iLvl 140 which is not such a huge difference however when a newly dinged 50 goes in with his iLvl 124 against a 600 expertise battlemaster who has iLvl 140 its pretty much an arrow to the knee. This should make everyone happy. The expertise bracket will be competetive for users who did their thing and the non expertise bracket will be a happy place for those of us who hate the fact that game devs divide the game into "groups" depending on what gear you wear. I can only find 2 disadvantages to this and that is: - Longer queues HOWEVER Bioware said they would add cross server pvp so this is no problem. - Battlemasters can no longer feel like gods just because they have lots of expertise And here are the advantages - No more QQ about Expertise being OP - Much Less problems for a newly dinged 50 to go into pvp - PvE'rs can enjoy warzones without having to ask themselves "am I a Liability to my group, without expertise?" - Seperating expertise should give more competetive warzones as well, and not a game of "who has most expertise"

Making one interesting story = no problem for the majority of people. Making over 200 stories, sidequests, mainplots etc, now thats the challenge. Especially because we consumers/gamers expect every little quest in the entire SWTOR universe to be as epic as the previous one, its a HUGE weight on an authors shoulders. My mom has been a professional writer for over 10 years and sells books. She personally say that anyone in the world and their mothers dog can write a good book: its the ability to keep making good books that make you a good writer.

I dont mind illum being there but dont call it world pvp. Its a disgrace to world pvp to call Illum that. Here let me create an analogy: World PvP: The Free Open Ocean of funzies Illum: A Fish Tank, trying its best to simulate something it can never be. And dont say "world pvp dont excist", having spent 12+hours a day at Black Rock Mountains during WoW:Vanilla I know exacly what world pvp feels like.

This part I agree with. Bioware could learn something from TBC.

Can I borrow this SWTOR damage/dps meter which you have? I would very much like it for my own raiding guild, thank you.

I stopped playing my full Rakata geared scoundrel (-Rakata belt). I am now levelling a shadow. Bioware loves Inquisitors and Consulars. 1722 Cunning (Without biochem, stims, or any other buffs than my own) 41% crit 78% Crit Multiplier despite the huge gear advantage I feel like I am weak compared to most other classes. Such ********. My mate, fairly worse geared Shadow has no trouble with damage and yet people keep yelling for nerfs for the scoundrel. Its as if we are all having a knife fight but everyone agreed that the scoundrel with a spoon still has the OP weapon. /now lvling a shadow

I stopped playing my full rakata geared scoundrel and are now lvling a shadow. Cant be arshed to play a class who smacks people with a washcloth. Looking at the majority of classes in this game it shocks me people still choose to cry about the operative/Scoundrel. Its like you have a gunfight and a knifefight and you cry that the scoundrel brought a spoon...

Are you kidding me? They nerfed the scoundrel/agent to the ground. Unless you have a significant gear advantage OR level advantage in the 10-49 bracket, a scoundrel/agent hits like a wet nuddle. First you got our main tree nerfed. Then you got surge, our only way to get damage again, nerfed. And now you want to remove our ability to stealth?

How to balance 8 computers: Make sure they are stacked with the same hardware. You are telling me sorceres are fine altho they have a slithly better processor. Im telling you to put in the same processor as the rest of us. You tell me that my processor isnt good enough because I am a bad computer engineer. But I am telling you that my processor is worse because bioware gave sorc a better processor to begin with. We have had the sorc discussion for too long on these forums and people use the same damn counter everytime. "lol you no kill sorc you bad. l2p". The core of the sorc is better than the average class in this game. Thats just how it is. Yes good players will make it work but il tell you one thing. if you played a sorc and you are a "good scoundrel" you would probably do even better as a sorc, because the core itself is better. Now I hope logic works, if not, then I give up.

I have a shadow alt and sorc are not that big a problem for shadows. Because Shadows have the one thing that would greatly help the scoundrel. Force Speed!

People make overpowered sound worse than it is. Sorc are not impossible or INSANELY Overpowered, they are slightly overpowered. Overpowered means you are stronger than the majority. I also said "Scoundrels need alot more effort to take down a sorc" compared to what a sorc needs to do to take down a scoundrel.

Its easy to make everything sound easy when your talking about it Also the things I think would soulve the problems with sorc for me is to add Root/slow to resolve as well as reposition various talents. The fact that sorc can get immune to stun and I cant get immune to roots is the dealbreaker for me. In WoW I would use the Rogue stuns at my disposal to get close to a frostmage (altho that was also next to impossible unless you had all your CCs ready).