I don't usually post on the forums but i felt like I had to chime in. Any competant PvPer who has an understanding of most of the specs in the game knows full well that 2.6 concealment operatives ARE ONLY EFFECTIVE AGAINST UNDERGEARED PVE'ERS AND BAD PVP'ERS. My main is a dps merc and I play Arsenal at the highest level while only recently dabbling in Pyro. These conc. opers are easier to kill than marauders( I eat marauders for breakfast) and are no threat to me whatsoever. Same is true on my sentinel. If i can kill them easily as a dps merc, then a sorc should have no prob. with a root(madness), knockback AND forcespeed? youd have to be seriously bad to let a concealment oper do dmg to you have his opener. I have an operative as well and I love dpsing on him, but guess what? In lethality spec, dots an cull are still better dmg than concealment. Whenever I see a concealment op i mark him and keep him dotted, this keeps him without his opener and with a 6m exfiltrate most of the game and makes them use one of their TWO measly defensive CD's(Dodge). Suffice to say that lethalty is still better than concealment. Please, just use your *********** brains. They are one of the easiest classes to counter and still not viable for ranked. There is a reason all the REPUTABLE people on these forums say concealment is not a problem and there is a reason why all the first time posters who demonstrate little to no knowledge of the pvp aspect of this game are crying " GAMEBREAKING" and " OP". TLDR: concealment ops are still ****. stop turning with your keyboards and get a mez or knockback off after their opener.

I predict that maras will get another defensive cooldown and operatives will get their roll nerfed.

Outlaws Den or Ilum around 9 PST sound good? Looking for some friendly 4v4s before PTS opens.

YES!! I need 4v4s! hit me up if you need my op heals or arsenal merc.(mercs will own in arenas) Or it's quite possible we'll be 4v4'ing each other haha -VomitHype

Indeed. Anybody on the Haze Blazers ranked team will tell you that I've almost never been able to run any of my 'dream comps' for 8v8 ranked(almost always taking a decption sin in exchange for a smash mara and rolling with no sniperslol). I have to say we have been rather successful. WIth 8v8 ranked being gone in October, everyone should just try to queue up every night, sub-optimal comps and all, should be fun.

Seeing as how 8v8 ranked will be replaced with 4v4 ranked arenas, I would like to setup up some friendly 4v4 matches on Ilum. All factions are welcome and I'll try to set this up on Thursday(8/15) around 7pm PST. My goal is to get in as much 4v4 experience as possible before the PTs goes live on 8/16. I'm very excited for Arenas because the classes I play(medic op and arsenal merc) are optimal for Arena play. So put together the best 4 man comp you can think of and come to Ilum tomorrow! Seems like 2 dps, 1 heals, and 1 tank will be the standard comp if anybody needs any ideas. If you're interested you can reply to this thread or send an in game mail/whisper to Vomitspit or Hyperbeam of Haze Blazers. (Won't be home until tomorrow)

He must have been 2 seconds late as well and got there after the delay, making so he can cap right when he gets to the node. That just shows how much slower your scoundrel was. Dude, not trolling or anything. The delay is there. The only reason I'm posting is because I don't know how alacrity rolling helps you get by the delay. The delay is there! Lol nobody knows about the delay, they just blindly whine about operatives.

lol. get a scoundre to 51 and roll to a civil war side node as fast as you can. see what happens when you try to cap it. The delay has been there, i've noticed it the first day 2.0 dropped. The delay is there in CW and all AHG rounds.

I did watch the video, the reason why it looks like the node is immediately available for cap is because of how slow your scoundrel is. Your slow scoundrel really exaggerates the other operatives speed. A lot of good scoundrels will agree that he was not just a little slow, but very slow. Do you have an op over 51 that you've played thousands of games on? Trust me, that delay is there, it's there in Civil War, it's there in AHG. I've encountered it countless times. Ive covered by plenty of nodes waiting to click on them. Alacrity only helps you get to the node faster, not cap it faster. If you alacrity roll to the node, it is impossible to cap faster than non alacrity operatives. Like I said, I'm pretty sure that delay was put there to avoid all this QQ. But people will still complain about classes they don't main. So, if the delay is there, what's the problem? The delay IS there.

what about the nodes being inactive for a moment before each game? the alacrity roller will get there but whats the point if he cant cap it? The thing is that an op with and without alacrity will start the cap at the exact same time. Like I said, alacrity doesn't decrease the amount of time the node remains inactive at the start of the match. WHAt's the difference?? alacrity or no alacrity, you are still limited by when that pylon activates. that's what i don't get. Alacrity doesnt help you cap faster in a civil war, whatsoever. Sure it will give you a 2 second advantage, but you still have to wait for that node. Please, just tell me how alacrity helps you cap faster in a civil war when there is a limit on when you are allowed to click on the node?? That limit will be the same, regardless of alacrity. This is only an issue for the first score of a huttball Just admit you didn't know that the nodes were inactive at the start of the match, tell your ops/scounds to hurry the **** up, and delete this post already.

Yes, their scoundrel was QUITE slow(taking speeder late, stealthing too early, not rolling to the edge then off it, not rolling off the rock). Which probably amplified the effect of the opposing operative's speed. Indeed, if he rolled correctly that cap would have been stopped with ease.

At the start of a Civil War the nodes will be inactive for about 10-15 secs after you are able to take the speeder(probably in an attempt to avoid people crying about the operative roll). This means that if you are somehow able to instantly appear at the node after landing on the speeder you wont be able to cap it for like 8 seconds. If you alacrity roll to the node, you cant cap it, you have to wait. The amount of time the nodes remain uncappable is enough time for BOTH teams to get to that node. Of course you get to your natural node faster, but the inacitve time is still enough for you to stop the cap on your unnatural node. Alacrity Roll in a Civil War only helps by making you wait an extra 1-3 seconds for the node to become active. Alacrity or not, you still have to wait for the node to activate. Alacrity will not make the node activate faster. How is alacrity roll so gamebreaking in civil war if youre not able to cap it any earlier then you would without alacrity? Same situation in Hypergate, nodes remain inactive for a few seconds after the gates open when the match starts as well as when a new round starts. I don't see how this is a problem besides in a huttball. Countless times Ive rolled to the node, go into cover, and spam the click on the node waiting for it to activate, only to be stopped by a sin or something halfway through the cap. No problem here as long as the operatives in your comp don't take the speeder late and know how/where to roll for speed(like when stopping a cap). If you give a good team a 3-4 second headstart, they will capitalize on it.

I main an operative and the nodes are not immediately available to cap our of the gate. IN CW and AHG i always roll for the cap and am forced to wait a couple seconds before i'm able to click on the node. Unless they changed something in the past two days

In games like Civil War and AHG the nodes aren't able to be captured until a certain time after the game starts. An operative without alacrity can make it to these nodes before they light up, so we have to wait a few seconds before we cap it. How would this help alacrity stacking operatives when non-stacked operatives can already get to the node before anyone is even able to cap it. Does stacking alacrity make it so you can cap the nodes earlier than intended? No. You can get to the node slightly before another operative but you won't be able to cap anything. This only seems to be a big deal in huttball, where you would get the first ball almost always against a non-alacrity stacked operative.

insanus!! i need you on your mara!!! this is Vomitspit ( GM of Haze Blazers). I havent been able to log on the past couple days but ill be back sunday. We try to queue every week-night( usually a very long pop) and 5-6 of our ranked team is on when we need them. For a while it was just us queing against tauntauns and medley(large skill gap between our team and theirs, but we snuck in a couple wins) just before they left, then after a couple weeks ranked started to pickup. We've improved and changed our team a lot the past month. It's true that pubs have more pvp guilds than us. We're probably the most active Pvp guild impside atm. Im pretty sure we are the only imp team that queues regularly for ranked but we see an imp team every once in a while. Doing great, but need just one or two more players for an awesome team. jaffen is a founder and majin'horse queues with us for ranked on his mara sometimes if hes online. seriously, all we are missing is a second mara and maybe some of your wisdom. :>

You guys act like there are only operatives on the opposing team. Scamper/Exfiltrate exist on BOTH factions. Group with an operative/scoudrel who can roll and shut up. You're making a big deal about seeing roll spam while chances are you have somebody roll spamming on your own team. All the lightsaber wielding noobs need to stop crying.

You guys act like there are only operatives on the opposing team. Scamper/Exfiltrate exist on BOTH factions. Group with an operative/scoudrel who can roll and shut up. All the lightsaber wielding noobs need to stop crying.

I'll post em when home. The only thing you have on me is my mistake about the tactical advantage DMG boost. ' I can't prove anything I'm saying, you're immature!!'. Haha. you can make all sorts of claims and theories but have nothing to prove them but edited-in-your-favor gameplay that nobody can use to critique all of your gameplay on a high level by somebody who's very familiar with the spec.

So I misunderstood the ability description, so what? The ability descriptions aren't exactly 100% clear so I was mislead and didn't do any research. Youre bending your math to favor your argument. I do t agree with your numbers at all. As for KBS, putting dart on everyone in the area and culling people below 30% health is all you have to do to get kbs. Which is what anybody plauing this spec should be doing. We should be getting the same number of KBS. I will have fun getting my 300k medal every single match, I posted it as a minimum, I usually get that medal before the match is half over. I get my fair share of 600k+ games, you should know numbers like that aren't uncommon. And solo kills, you're mad because you can't get em. Play this class a bit more and you can solo and burst better than concealment without all the issues associated with concealment I think ive gotten 14 solo kills before in a game. I play this class however I'm feeling, I succeed as a solo kill node capper ( like in the video above) and as aoe DPS. That's why I love this spec. Like I said, upload some unedited gameplay for me to watch. I think we got off on the wrong foot and I've learned a lot from this discussion. Thank you for helping me improve my game.

http://youtube.com/#/watch?v=mlbGIEpfaPE&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DmlbGIEpfaPE I think you're in denial about never losing any TA. I know it happens to you all the time. Our culls will be equal, but at the end of the game I get off more culls than you. More damage. Of course duration doesn't directly increase damage. Only time I save ta is when there's no good reason to use it. I use it first chance i get at the ideal times AND still have stacks on me. Do you cull people who only have one dot on them? If there's nobody in range to shiv, stim boost is up and on cool down, what do you do? Watch your extra 2 or 4% DMG dissapear in 3seconds? The thing is I'll have 2 stacks of ta with stim boost up and on cooldown and nobody around to ideally cull.( dart on them but not corrosive grenade). In that situation. I'm using non poison attacks with a DMG boost(ta), you'll be running with no stacks and having to shiv. Once c.grenade is off cool down. I just cull,cull, shiv,cull and you'll just shiv and cull. I do substantially more damage. 300 to 600k most games when I'm not constantly attacking the off node. I hurt the epeens of most skilled marauders and power techs constantly. I love putting the agent symbol at the top of the damage boards Enjoy the video. I'll upload all my games with commentary after my break. I've got plenty of as and vids of me doing 300k+ dmg and 3+ solo kills to share. However, i Won't be at my desktop till sunday. I'd like to see some unedited gameplay of yours. I wanna see how many culls you miss out on per game

The extra damage I get from the extra duration far outweighs your measly 6%. Not to mention the DMG boost I get from having a stack of ta on me most of the time.(2% per stack on all DMG rather than on one ability) so I'll be doing more damage than you and have all my goodies. Play the spec a bit more.

I know talent boxes that give you + % increase in damage are attractive, but it's not all about damage. 6% on dart is not losing much. You get a 500k dmg game, which is not uncommon, let's say that 200k is from dart damage. Put in that extra point for 6% damage and you'd only gain 18k damage. So yes, I'd take the extra 2 seconds over the 18k dart damage any day. I'd even take an extra one second over that %6. Like i said, I think having 2 points in med consult is mandatory. It changes the way the class plays drastically, for the better.

I love my third snare/root breaker. aoe slow is for noobs. - Vomitspit :> ( the reason i take the extra snare/rootbreaker is because I save evasion to cleanse dots that Toxin Scan has no effect on, not to break snares/roots. Evasion can cleanse MULTIPLE dots, another reason why I like to save it rather than use it just to cleanse a root/snare. Evasion is key to taking down Powertechs by making it very difficult to do dot dmg and hit you with railshot ( pt puts dot on you, toxin scan immediately, he puts it back on, evasion immediately which removes the dot and will make the railshot miss after he puts his dot on you the third time due to the 100% chance to dodge white dmg). Toxin Scan also doesnt cleanse some snares/roots, whereas Counterstike removes all movement impairing effects. Being able to use Toxin Scan, Evasion, and Countermeasures at the correct times (ex; using countermeasures when you know Toxin Scan won't work and using evasion to cleanse a dot that Toxin scan has no effect on) will keep pretty much ALL dots and snares/roots off you, making you very mobile and bolstering our lame defense. I'm a strong proponent of putting 2 points in Counterstrike. i also believe having at least 1 point in medical consult is a must(i think my current spec has 3 points in med consult, but i usually run with 2 points). You can shiv on cooldown to gain/maintain TA, but what's the point if you lose it after being CC'd for a couple seconds. Losing a stack of TA everytime youre cc'd for 3-4 seconds (in a game where cc is abundant) cripples this spec. I'll upload more leth gameplay videos when I'm off break so you know this isn't coming from somebody who can't play the spec. I like to think im well versed on the subject of lethality PvP. lol also, imy Insanus haha also ****in hype for 2.0 leth. Here's my main spec : http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#401McMZhZhrbkrMhdGR.2 my spec for huttball: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#401McMZbZhrbkrrhdrR.2 try this if you want the aoe slow AND extra root/snarebreaker my current spec and will probably become my main spec until 2.0 comes out : http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#401MccZbZhrbkrMhdGR.2 (able to generate 2 stacks of TA at mid in Civil War with KI and have it last all the way to one of the side nodes to burst somebody down faster than a concealment OP to take the node is sick. TA will also outlast any CC)

Hey sign up Vomitspit (me), if it's not too late.

here's a hypergate